COLLECTIVE MADNESS


“Soft despotism is a term coined by Alexis de Tocqueville describing the state into which a country overrun by "a network of small complicated rules" might degrade. Soft despotism is different from despotism (also called 'hard despotism') in the sense that it is not obvious to the people."

Sunday, May 13, 2007

Secularism Under Assault in Turkey.


It has been argued here and other like-minded blogs that the most welcome outcome in the conflict with radical Islam would be the triumph of secularism over theocracy. That is on the line in Turkey. What can we do, if anything, to ensure secularism succeeds in Turkey and possibly have that strengthened and spread throughout the Islamic world?

Turkish secularists in new rally BBC

Boats joined the rally alongside Izmir's seafront.

Hundreds of thousands of Turks have rallied in the city of Izmir to protest against any government plans to undermine Turkish secularism.
The major demonstration is the latest since the ruling AK Party nominated Foreign Minister Abdullah Gul as its candidate for the country's presidency.

Many Turks suspect Mr Gul of having an Islamic agenda, something he denied before withdrawing from his candidacy.

Parliamentary elections scheduled for November are now to be held in July.

The AK Party - which has roots its in political Islam - argues that a general election will only prove that it commands widespread public support.

The government has also backed a constitutional reform package that would allow the president to be directly elected by the people.

The BBC's Sarah Rainsford, in Istanbul, says an AK Party candidate would be likely to win any presidential vote.

Opposition alliances

The demonstration in Izmir - Turkey's third-largest city - was the fourth mass gathering in favour of the republic in as many weeks.

"These rallies have been useful in forcing the government to take a step back, " protester Neslihan Erkan told the Reuters news agency.

"The danger is still not over. These rallies must continue until there is no longer a threat."

Many secularists consider the government's efforts to confirm Mr Gul as president as evidence of a hidden Islamist political agenda.

Nationalist opposition parties boycotted two parliamentary votes on the issue.

They are now forming strategic alliances to try to weaken the ruling party at the upcoming elections, our correspondent adds.

The military, which regards itself as the guardian of Turkey's secularism, has also indicated its opposition to the AK Party's move.


31 comments:

  1. I wish the Turks all the luck in the world, although a pure secular state is a myth!

    ... at last! we have an example of moderate Islam!

    ReplyDelete
  2. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Deuce,

    From sayonara to mutiple threads on a Sunday. I applaud your recuperative powers.

    Glad to have you back full time and apparently happy

    ReplyDelete
  4. May 5, 2007

    That's all folks!
    How did you do it? Give me the magic tonic formula pleeese.

    I want to thank all of you for your support and participation with the Elephant project. It started as a whim and a reaction to the closing off of comments at The Belmont Club. In many ways this has been a success. In others a failure. Comments, visits and page views have grown and April was our best month. I have enjoyed the experience and promised myself that when it took too much of my time and became less fun, it would end. That time has arrived.

    I want to extend special thanks to my co-host and friend who I never met, Whit. We have talked on the phone and exchanged laughs and views and discussed the world of the blog. I will miss some of the clever smart people who I have had the pleasure to exchanges views with. I confess that I will not miss the pettiness and petulance that goes with the territory. That is just the way it goes. I have no animosity or ill feelings to anyone.

    Personally, I will return to my privacy and focus more on the creative part of my busy and full life. Best of luck to all of you. I mean that. - Deuce

    ReplyDelete
  5. Thanks habu, You and the other loyal fans, my partner whit, and a break from a rugged travel schedule all helped to reinvigorate me.

    I sometimes forget that I am no longer nineteen.

    ReplyDelete
  6. I also realize that this is not my blog. It is our blog. Wretchard made the same mistake. It is much like painting a picture or writing a story. At some stage it becomes its own thing and the creator becomes part of the creation. It takes its own shape and leads.

    ReplyDelete
  7. 2164th: Thanks habu, You and the other loyal fans, my partner whit, and a break from a rugged travel schedule all helped to reinvigorate me.

    This reminds me of shortest book in the world: "My Life On The Wagon" by Ted Kennedy.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Deuce,
    Whatever the reason was I'm glad. I noticed, it as did others, your writing talents were developing at an astonishing rate.
    I could learn more from one of your thread set ups than I could from reading six sources. That and it was readable, always a big plus.

    Bravo sir!
    Habu

    ReplyDelete
  9. T,
    I think that publication was "My life with a flagon"

    ReplyDelete
  10. Glad to see you back, Ms T. I want to apologize for not welcoming you on board when you stepped up to the plate. You are welcome to post whenever you wish.

    Happy Mother's Day to All:

    Make someone feel special.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Hillary's Book Reviews

    REVIEWS OF HILLARY'S NEW BOOK


    "Hillary Clinton's 506-page memoirs have come out. So much of her personality shines through, that in the end, you, too, will want to sleep with an intern."
    - Craig Kilborn

    In Hillary Clinton's new book 'Living History,' Hillary details what it was like meeting Bill Clinton, falling in love with him, getting married, and living a passionate, wonderful life as husband and wife. Then on page two, the trouble starts."
    - Jay Leno

    "In the book she says when Bill told her he was having an affair, she said 'I could hardly breathe, I was gulping for air.' No, wait, I'm sorry, that's what Monica said."
    - David Letterman

    "Hillary Clinton, our junior senator from New York, announced that she has no intentions of ever, ever running for office of the President of the United States. Her husband, Bill Clinton, is bitterly disappointed. He is crushed. There go his dreams of becoming a two-impeachment family."
    - David Letterman

    "Last night, Senator Hillary Clinton hosted her first party in her new home in Washington. People said it was a lot like the parties she used to host at the White House. In fact, even the furniture was the same."
    - Jay Leno

    "Senator Hillary Clinton is attacking President Bush for breaking his campaign promise to cut carbon dioxide emissions, saying a promise made, a promise broken. And then out of habit, she demanded that Bush spend the night on the couch."
    - Craig Kilborn

    " CNN found that Hillary Clinton is the most admired woman in America. Women admire her because she's strong and successful. Men admire her because she allows her husband to cheat and get away with It."
    - Jay Leno


    "Hillary Clinton is the junior senator from the great state of New York. When they swore her in, she used the Clinton family Bible. . the one with only seven commandments."
    -David Letterman

    ReplyDelete
  12. What can we do to aid in keeping Turkey secular?/

    1.Make sure the Turkish generals get their bakshish deposited in a timely fashion.

    2.Make sure our paid assassins are in place....just in case.

    3.Let them know that Çanakkale Savaşları,(the Battle of Gallipoli) will be reviewed by a panel of revisionist historians and the victory awarded to the Australians and Kiwis.

    4. There can be no more camel sex.

    That should just about do it.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Q. What does Bill Clinton say after sex?
    A. "I'll be home in an hour, Hillary."

    Bill wears briefs. Hillary wears boxers...she needs the extra room.

    Happiness is Hillary Clinton's face on a milk carton.

    Hillary Clinton in an apron is like Michael Dukakis in a tank.

    How did Bill and Hillary meet? They dated the same woman!

    Slick: "I feel your pain". Hillary: "I *AM* your pain!!!"

    The "Hillary" pack at KFC: no breasts, large thighs; all left-wings.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Several threads ago....

    trish said...
    Agreement between Musharraf and the administration.

    We can only pinprick in Pakistan.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

    I can only concur pointing out that there are a great number of pricks in Pakistan to pin, con brio!

    ReplyDelete
  15. Hillary gets up in the middle of the night to attend the powder room. Turning to Bill she says,
    "Save my place will ya?"

    ReplyDelete
  16. If I could get serious for a moment ....naw

    ReplyDelete
  17. I too say, it is good to have Miss T. back, that lady that knows Mark Twain like her heartbeat.

    Hey, Habu, go back to some other pic, that EYEBALL really freaks me out.

    ReplyDelete
  18. Great News!

    By NOOR KHAN, Associated Press Writer

    3 hours ago

    KANDAHAR, Afghanistan - The Taliban's most prominent military commander, a one-legged fighter who orchestrated an ethnic massacre and a rash of beheadings, was killed in a U.S.-led military operation in southern Afghanistan, officials said Sunday.

    Mullah Dadullah, a top lieutenant of Taliban leader Mullah Omar, was killed Saturday in the southern province of Helmand, said Said Ansari, the spokesman for Afghanistan's intelligence service. NATO confirmed his death, calling it "a serious blow" to the insurgency.

    Dadullah is one of the highest-ranking Taliban leaders killed since the fall of the hard-line regime following the U.S.-led invasion in 2001. His death represents a major victory for the Afghan government and the international coalition that has struggled to contain a Taliban-led insurgency wracking the south and east of the country.

    "Mullah Dadullah was the backbone of the Taliban," said Asadullah Khalid, governor of the former Taliban stronghold of Kandahar. "He was a brutal and cruel commander who killed and beheaded Afghan civilians."

    ReplyDelete
  19. Well, whit, if the Taliban is a small group of organized thugs, then taking one of them out could really make a difference.
    If it is a popular social and cultural movement, killing a "Commander" won't mean a thing.

    ReplyDelete
  20. We took out the aQ "Commander" in Iraq, last summer.
    Didn't even slow them down, let alone set them back.
    Violence, across the board, has increased since the Z miester bought his piece of Iraq.

    ReplyDelete
  21. habu linked to the story of how US intel folk believe that aQ is staged to take over large swaths of Iraq. Even after the Z miester died.

    We kill sub-Commanders of the Insurgents, regularily, there in Iraq.

    Killing "named" individuals will not be enough, not in Iraq or Afghanistan.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Why secularism?

    The Taliban "secularized" the cliffs housing the monster Buddhas and everyone got bent all out of shape.

    Well, nobody else, including Catholics, Protestants and Jews would do it, so maybe that was the Taliban's purpose in life, blasting away the overstuffed idols.

    Have your obligitory PBS cultural fit of the vapors first, and then flame away, and then tell me you would be willing to see Mecca and Medina reduced to ruins.

    ReplyDelete
  23. Secularism has to do with the world outside the church. It is not an attack on the church or religion. Blasting away at ancient statues is not secularism. It is just the opposite.

    ReplyDelete
  24. They were destroyed because they were an image that was offensive to the absurd petty and lethal world of Islam.

    ReplyDelete
  25. Now this is one sweet bit of news:
    Mullah Dadullah dead.

    ReplyDelete
  26. DISNEY CLAIMS MULLAH DADULLA BODY

    In a surprise what goes around comes around move Disney, Inc, has claimed the body of the one legged mullah.
    Spokesman for Disney says "we can fit the cadaver into out next Pirates of the Carribean movie.

    The dead muulah was not available for comment.

    ReplyDelete
  27. bobalharb, The really freaky thing about that eye is that in a close up of it there is the picture of a human skull in the pupil.

    It is a famous work by M. C. Escher, a Dutch graphic artist. Esher art is needless to say very very unique. If you ever get a chance to see a good art book on his work take a good look!!

    ReplyDelete
  28. 2164th: Secularism has to do with the world outside the church. It is not an attack on the church or religion. Blasting away at ancient statues is not secularism. It is just the opposite.

    How come the Taliban get all kinds of grief for doing what we read about in Sunday school?

    2Chr.34:1-7 ...in the eighth year of [Josiah's] reign, while he was yet young, he began to seek after the God of David his father...And they brake down the altars of Baalim in his presence; and the images, that were on high above them, he cut down; and the groves, and the carved images, and the molten images, he brake in pieces, and made dust of them, and strowed it upon the graves of them that had sacrificed unto them....And when he had broken down the altars and the groves, and had beaten the graven images into powder, and cut down all the idols throughout all the land of Israel, he returned to Jerusalem.

    ReplyDelete