The morning, the MSM, apparently not satisfied with the results of the US mid-term elections, advances the leftist defeatist agenda with relentless calls for retreat or as they like to phrase it, "redeployment."
Of course, we in the traditional west aren't helping matters with leaders like Ehud Olmert. Olmert is in the United States and so far the money quote is:
"They (the Iranians) have to be afraid of the consequences if there isn't a compromise," spokeswoman Miri Eisin cited Olmert as telling journalists on the flight to Washington."I dare you to step over that line. Okay, I dare you to step over this line. How dare you! I'll slap you silly with sanctions" Sorry, folks, that is not confidence inspiring leadership in the face of a determined threat.
Contrast Olmert's call for "compromise or else" with the on-going offensive being waged by Iran.
TEHRAN, Iran - Iran's Foreign Ministry spokesman said Sunday that his country's Revolutionary Guards would strongly and immediately respond to any Israeli attack.Perhaps we have entered the new, Teddy Roosevelt, "Talk Softly But Carry a Big Stick" post Iraq/post Lebanon phase of diplomacy but I doubt it. The west seems to have lost what little will it had to resist. TWAT fatigue is the new malaise. Canada, never stalwart, has had enough. 32 dead soldiers this year and they want to call it quits. That's terrific resolve in the face of adversity. Admirable multi-culti people, those rational, peace loving Canucks. But like their fellow leftists in Britain, Mexico and the United States, at least they know who the real enemy is.
"If the Zionist regime commits such stupidity, the response by the Iranian military will be swift, strong and crushing," Mohammed Ali Hosseini said. "Iran will take no longer than a second to respond."
TORONTO - A majority of people in Canada, Britain and Mexico think President Bush and his foreign policy pose a threat to world peace and worry the U.S. will invade Iran or North Korea within two years, according to polling released Friday.As the Mullahs and Imams lead the Muslim world and rail against the Great Satan, westerners turn to their own Moral Authorities. I don't who is more frightening, us or them? This morning, is there any doubt who will prevail?
Bugler, Sound "Recall" and "Retreat."
Redeploy to Warizistan, now that's a plan I'd support.
ReplyDeleteDoubt that's happenin', though.
Rat:
ReplyDeleteI'm expecting the Democrats to propose just that action, after all, they've been saying that's where the real war is.
Well, according to the WaPo, the Dems position may just come down to that Marine from the Reagan years, no not Ollie, but Senator Webb.
ReplyDeleteWebb, an early opponent of the war in Iraq, might make his mark in the Senate in foreign and military affairs. Current and former politicians said they expect him to become the face of the Democratic Party's antiwar movement.
"It will make him a very important person," said former Nebraska senator Bob Kerrey (D)< Navy SEAL), who had urged Webb to run. "If the question is how you structure our military for the future, he is going to come with a lot of knowledge."
Kerrey said Webb will become a magnet for senators who want him to co-sponsor their foreign-policy bills to give them credibility.
Webb May Be Senate Maverick
Newest Member Expected to Take Antiwar Lead
I've just been shocked.
ReplyDeleteOver at the BC, good ole' aristide has caught up to where I was three years ago. He has abandoned his call for translating Moby Dick. Now he sees the need for rapid action, on the transnational propaganda battle.
Wow!, aristide says "... Start flooding the airwaves. Capture the narrative. Own the context. ..."
Finally, the chickenhawks are staating to see some sense. He must have signed a multi-media company to front for, in his never ending quest for Federal funding.
DR,
ReplyDeleteI don't think they were capable of remaining blind to the realities of Islams aggressive tenets. The more they learned of Islamic history the less they could deny that we are in a ear of civilizations. That VDH piece I reference in the other thread is really good..Not to force it on ya but here she is again in case ya missed her
The New Appeasement"
His secretarial help and editor.
Helper
Got Damn, Habu; my wife's going to come in here one of these days when I'm clicking on one of your links, and you're going to lose a correspondent, and friend.
ReplyDeleterufus said:
ReplyDeleteGot Damn, Habu; my wife's going to come in here one of these days when I'm clicking on one of your links, and you're going to lose a correspondent, and friend.
That's why you gotta set "F2" to display a spreadsheet and keep your left hand over that Boss Button in case she comes in.
Tell her it's part of the war effort ..that the Marines voted her the best morale booster and several erected monuments to her.
ReplyDeleteThat should get you sleeping with P-Tater down in the bog
I do know what you mean though. I have her in my workout room and my wife thinks it's an insult to her.
ReplyDeleteI explained that blah,blah, none of which worked..but she's still there.
I gotta check out that f2 ploy. I stay in enough trouble, in the natural course of things. I spend half my day splaining, as it is.
ReplyDeleteRufus,
ReplyDeleteAll married men spend a good deal of time'splain'in...
Let me give ya an example. When I got up this morning it was 64 degrees in the house. I said
"Dear" I think 64 degrees is a little chilly ...then I had to 'splain my way to get it all the way up to 69-70..took about 10 minutes.
I know I was being unreasonable, and all but I like my indoor comforts. I do enough Jeremiah Johnson stuff outside.
Better get used to Iran without oil.
ReplyDeleteYou oughta try bein married to a Korean. They never get hot in the Summer, and they NEVER GET COLD in the Winter. I can't explain it; it's a genetic thing, I guess.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, I always wake up a little chilled. Like you, I find 64 - 65 a little nippy on my bare ass, and feet. So, every mornin, I fire up the electric oven in the kitchen, and crack the oven door for a few minutes. I got a couple of fireplaces, but they're gas, and the one in the living room is giving me problems.
ANYHOO, half the morning, every morning, discussing my propensity for wanting to shuck the icicles off my balls. Jeez, and that's before we spend the rest of the day discussing why I don't figure out how to fix the fireplace. I really hate this particular discussion since I seem to be on really unsteady ground on this one.
And there you have it. Thermostat wars are just oil wars and partisan bickering writ small.
ReplyDeleteRufus,
ReplyDeleteI feel for ya but remember i married a Montanan with a Black Belt 2nd degree in Tae Kwon Do, Korean. And she's an alpha female. Put herself through Univ of Florida waiting tables. Unreal grit.
I usually cry "uncle"....if momma ain't happy, ain't no one happy.
Here try this pic:
OK PIC
catherine
ReplyDeleteyou must remember men have fragile egos and suffer from "shirkage" in cold weather of water.
and that is writ small!
Well, yeah, that was a pretty car, alright; and, I guess that if you filled her up with 200 proof it'd run pretty good, and all; but, somehow, Habu,
ReplyDeleteI've grown to expect "more" from you.
Ok Rufus here she goes..THE ULTIMATE:
ReplyDeleteBEST
of course it's a '59 not '62
ReplyDeleteHabu, "shirkage"? That's hard to believe :)
ReplyDeleteI've the opposite thermostat problem and have to take a “think ignobly, react vocally” approach to insisting the temp in here exceed 50 degrees in winter.
Your woman sounds like a great gal. Maybe Montanans know how to keep warm without burning fossil fuel.
The War Nerd has a new article up:
ReplyDeleteThe Doctrine of Asymmetrical War
Do read.
Buddy, et al; This is one reason I like Dupont. They are hip-deep in this, and this just might be where we end up.
ReplyDeleteIt's Ethanol, without the downsides.
catherine
ReplyDeleteof course if i proofread anything you would have read "shrinkage", but I do beleive you got the message..Hey what's a vowel here an consonant there..but maybe I better look up ..whew shirk but no shirkage ..I never shirk, head ache maybe, but not shirk.
Habu,
ReplyDeleteIt was a swell typo!
Here's Trish's link to the War Nerd.
Besides his idea that our mil high-tech is beside the point, Gary says our enemies don't want democracy because they're "god-fearing gangbangers" and "superstitious tribalists" who want to die.
He didn't actually say so, but I'm thinking he might have also meant the Dems with their Soros-Gaia God-ess suicide pact, and not just jihadists.
oh, that shirkage is WAY worse than mere shrinkage. apples and oranges. day and night. flick and flack.
ReplyDelete"swell" typo...ahhh...gaaawd....
ReplyDeleteI don't know whatcha talking about, Buddy.
ReplyDeleteof course not, Florence King--I mean, Catherine.
ReplyDeleteHere's War Nerds summary of his talking points:
ReplyDelete1. Most wars are asymmetrical / irregular.
2. In these wars, the guerrillas / irregulars / insurgents do NOT aim for military victory.
3. You can NOT defeat these groups by killing lots of their members.
In fact, they want you to do that.
4. Hi-tech weaponry is mostly useless in these wars.
5. "Hearts and Minds," meaning propaganda and morale, are more important than military superiority.
6. Most people are not rational, they are TRIBAL: "my gang yay, your gang boo!" It really is that simple. The rest is cosmetics.
Interesting reading.
Comment from Old Crow, at Gateway Pundit involving the camera footage of the American Carrier:
ReplyDeleteNo we would not have shot it down. It was probably shot from the Iranian P3 which overflys our ships on a daily basis in the Gulf. I remember one time the Iranians sent a helo out to take pictures of us and they got so close we thought they were going to land on our deck instead a bunch of us gave them the international one finger salute. Normal procedure is to warn them off via Military Air Distress(MAD) radio if flight OP's are ongoing but they usually just ignore that this is no big deal and like I said happens just about everyday in the Gulf. Also understand we would have had that Aircraft Identified and tracked almost from the moment it took off in Iran, believe me when I say a fly could not get near a carrier without us knowing what color its ass hairs are.
Interesting, but incomplete/disingenuous.
ReplyDeleteWhat he describes is in it's entirety the "Mohammedan" Wars, as Rat calls them. It doesn't apply anywhere else.
Let your Army atrophy enough, and see if the good, old-fashioned kind doesn't break out around your ears.
whit said:
ReplyDeleteMost people are not rational, they are TRIBAL: "my gang yay, your gang boo!" It really is that simple. The rest is cosmetics.
We saw this on November 7th when the Big Government soft-on-immigration Demlicans took over the House and Senate from the Big Government soft-on-immigration Republicrats.
Exactly. The western way is still superior, for its land-holding power. western way keeps the necessities of life flowing. The 4th gen stuff operates only in the crevasse between the domesticated herd and it's shepard dogs.
ReplyDeletetess, you'll see the difference between the parties soon enough. say, when Jay Rockefeller takes over the Intelligence Chair.
ReplyDeleteBuddy, I think we're completely out of the game, now; do you think that Israel can do Iran's nuke program on it's own?
ReplyDeleteI don't see how in the hell they can.
ReplyDeleteAt least, I don't see any way they can short of using nukes. If Bush gave them tactical bunker-busters, he'd be impeached, and possibly imprisoned.
ReplyDeleteIf they attempted to use our 5,000 lb bunker busters, we'd have to refuel them, and they'd still have to get through some pretty robust Soviet anti-aircraft hoops.
ReplyDeleteUI think we've sold 'em some KC-135s, two, IIRC. But, Gen McEnirny (AF ret) on tv has mentioned that USA could do it with a short bombing campaign--did he say 72 hrs? I just have no idear how good the Iranian air defense is.
ReplyDeleteI'd be surprised if Israel didn't have they own bunker-busters--they've had a couple years in crisis mode, now.
ReplyDeleteIsrael will use its naval assets to go after Iran's oil infrastructure. This will slow the Iranians, and give the Israelis a bit more time to prepare the next move.
ReplyDeleteBuddy, our B-2 wouldn't have to be dodging anti-air stuff all the way and they carry a pretty substantial payload. We, also, wouldn't have any trouble shooting down anyone who got too close to our "pretty boys," but the Israelis would find the going a whole hell of a lot tougher.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I think they found out a couple of months, ago, that their 2,000 lb'rs aren't quite a potent as they thought they'd be.
I don't know; it just sounds like a pretty tough mission, to me.
Redaktor, I doubt the "go after the oil" scenario. It would piss the rest of the world off, and still not do anything to solve the "existential" problem. If anything, it would make it harder for us to help them out, at all.
ReplyDeleteIt looks like a pretty sticky wicket, to me.
ReplyDeleteWhy does the thought of Jimmie Doolittle keep popping into my head?
The "rest of the world" would have only itself to blame. Israel gave the "rest of the world" a fair chance to resolve this. They did nothing. Time is running out, and Israel should already be discounting the rest of the world, as far as any help.
ReplyDeleteRedactor is right--Israel is past the point of owning the luxury of worrying about the rest of the world's pique.
ReplyDeleteThey'll probably lose a lot of planes, too.
The rest of the world already asked them to shut and take it like a man, to keep WWII from starting. And it didn't work anyway.
ReplyDeleteGawd amighty, that Doolittle raid was ballsy. Unbelieveable. But true.
ReplyDeleteWhy does the thought of Jimmie Doolittle keep popping into my head?
ReplyDeleteIt was a tactical pinprick, but it caused the Japanese to choose to strike East across the Pacific instead of polishing off Australia and locking down their oil assets in Indonesia. And that, in turn, led to Midway. Scratch four flattops.
Catherine,
ReplyDeletePriceless comment.
Now the Israeli vs Iran can they do it question.
I don't think they have a choice.
It would be damn nice if we joined them and they got to use the direct route over Iraq.
I believe that will be on the table for discussion, but a very tough discussion with Baker in the mix now. That would mean screw the Iraqi's but, ah golly too damn bad as they have shown to be ingrates so far anyway.
If they have to go the long way they will. As far as what they have to bust'em with I'm not sure any of us can get close to the answer.
Of course I had my "wish" for a pre mid term strike fizz, but I knew, and said at the time, that it would be much tougher after the mid terms to get us involved. Bush, however has a moral duty to get Iran off the worry list.
I'd prefer the B2,B52,B1,cruise and laser options. It just needs to get done or BOHICA for the Israeli's and the world.
we already have four seperate terror group threats advertised worldwide, to attack Americans in retaliation for not censuring Israel's gaza kassam-interdiction, at the UN t'other day.
ReplyDeleteOh, yeah, we gonna get along FINE with Iranian nukes scattered all over the world.
OK, I wasted my time reading the war nerd article.
ReplyDeleteI'm not going to go point by point but let me cherry pick a few time honored war maxims.
His point that you don't win by killing the enemy in large numbers. It hardly deserves a response, but let me say that if we level,level,level a few large cities with airstrikes these asymmetrical wars would end quick, quick quick.
Winning hearts and minds...some acedemic Quaker thought up that one. Let's take a look at his tribe vs. tribe, and place it next to winning hearts and minds. How's that accomplished on both sides simultaneously? Nothing can simultaneouly be and not be. Everything that is ,exists...if tribes hate other tribes forget the hearts and minds.
Setpiece wars. Right now on the wane but they will never disappear.
The unfortunate
truth which he doesn't dilate much
is that we are much too soft on prosecuting the conflicts we've ben engaged in. In Somalia, in Iraq, in LA..we use a tiny portion of our power.
I have said it before, these illiterate people don't understand "shock and awe" as destroying with pinpoint accuracy the building next door while their kabob doesn't even get knocked to the floor. You have to communicate to them on their level, which means shock and awe is leveling half their city the first night and let them ponder that in the light of day..if they don't buy into to quiting then on night two the other half of the city goes, along with 3-5 million people.
For my money the guy is full of crap.
Or a commie from Frenso.
ReplyDeleteI had a simyilar thought--that he assumes our current level of war-will is a non-variable constant.
ReplyDeletewhere the frig is "Frenso"?
ReplyDeleteredakt0r
ReplyDeleteIsrael will use its naval assets to go after Iran's oil infrastructure. This will slow the Iranians, and give the Israelis a bit more time to prepare the next move.
When a little guy with gadgets goes after a big guy with muscles, he's got to make sure he knocks the big guy out early on. Because it if turns into a slugging match, the big guy with muscles is gonna win every time.
Frenso Fresno Freak. Waht de diff?
ReplyDeleteWhat's your point woman?
ReplyDeletewell, it's important to Frensonians who need to know where they are
ReplyDeleteThey Spanish (and Russian apparently) over there, so how does it matter?
ReplyDeletenah, Frenso is Bakersfield Californy Hillbilly. Buck Owens country.
ReplyDeleteNot when I was there.
ReplyDeleteAdmittedly, I was in Fresno, not Frenso.
ReplyDeletewell, the worst Iran can do, non-nuke, is spasm out a bunch of theater weapons at the Israeli cities and maybe the Sunni oilfields if they go down hard. That and the terror cells scattered around. it won't be pretty, but will it get better any other way? They can interdict the straits for some limited amount of time. What else?
ReplyDeleteFresno is the non-descript city of billboards you have to plow through to get to the good stuff (Yosemite)
ReplyDeleteWhich is what I did, woman. Now please explain your other post.
ReplyDeleteThey could attack Frenso, Ca. I yahooed it, and it seems it's a good place to buy purebred Chihuahua puppies.
ReplyDeleteSo, go ahead, attack Iran, and kill the puppies; you Republican Pigs.
SAVE THE PUPPIES!
ReplyDeleteVOTE FOR PEACE!
Then you weren't in Frenso. Anyway it might have been that other Buck Owens, the guy at the Frenso Exxon station.
ReplyDeleteBuddy,
ReplyDeleteWith the collapse of the Iranian economy, the Mullahs will be busy with other more pressing things, like trying to save their neck.
DO IT FOR THE PUPPIES!
ReplyDeleteRedactor, that's what we've been saying about Fidel since 1962.
ReplyDeleteYou're either WITH us, or you're a Frenso Puppy-Killer. now we're getting into the think tank stuff.
ReplyDeleteFYI, I posted this at the BC:
ReplyDelete2164th said...
Interesting how things work out. When Wretchard closed comments down in a decision he eventually reversed, a few of the more prolific posters moved over to the Elephant Bar. I set it up as a back-up. They continue to blog on both sites as there is a fair amount of differences on both blogs. I love the Belmont Club. It has the finest mix on intelligent commentary on the net. I will continue to blog here because it is an opportunity and a challenge to exchange ideas.
Since the forming of the EB, C4 has been making a larger foot print at the BC. I have been following his commentary, which is 85% brilliant, 65% right and usually 90% sullied with anti-Jewish rhetoric. It occludes his vision and judgment and flaws the man, or exposes the flaws in the man. He has never entered into a one on one over at the EB, because he knows he will get his clock cleaned on a toe to toe. I would welcome an engagement here or at the EB and ask Wretchard to suspend the rules and open up a forum to allow C4 to respond in real time, with the suspension of the Queensbury rules.
I am sure C4 is up to the challenge.
11/12/2006 03:42:30 PM
Delete
What does the delete at the bottom mean?
ReplyDeleteRufus,
ReplyDeleteI just don't see Russia as a big investor in Iran's pistachio industry.
a cut and paste on the preview
ReplyDeleteI can't get anything past you rufus.
ReplyDeleteThe Russians obviously would be a huge winner in the destruction of the Iranian oil fields. Oil would immediately go North of a Hundred Dollars a Barrel. One could only guess how high. As a Nation that exports six or seven million gallons/day a doubling of the price would be a Windfall of Biblical proportions.
ReplyDeleteAnother $700 Billion/yr added onto our $800 Billion/yr, though, could cause some real trouble here in River City.
ReplyDeleteAnother $700 Billion/yr added onto our $800 Billion/yr, though, could cause some real trouble here in River City.
ReplyDeleteI was, obviously, meaning to refer to our trade deficit.
We would probably be looking at 70's numbers, again. 10% Unemployment, 12 - 15% Inflation, 15% home mortgage rates.
ReplyDeleteRufus,
ReplyDeleteRussia will be a big loser medium to long term, as the biofuel alternatives become the reality. Take the subsidies big oil now gets and plow it into biomass energy. Iran supplies about 4% of the world's oil. That capacity can and should easily be replaced with ethanol.
The question is not. really, how fast can Irans' 4% of the market be replaced, but for how long the markets can doe without the 20% that transits the Straits?
ReplyDeleteAs the IDF proved in Lebanon, air superiority cannot stop rocket launches. With tankers as targets, the Straits could be down for months, at least.
That's a concern for insurance companies.
ReplyDeleteredaktør
ReplyDeletei'm all wif ya frend ona casional mispelted wurd. it ain't like day don't git it, they juz be stclers for propper gramer
i knew xacto what you was say'n 'cept i always taught it was frectoe.
Now that the French nuclear arsenal has been modified to extend its' range, with the presumed target Tehran, could it now as easily reach Tel Aviv?
ReplyDeleteThe Russians as well?
Yeah, that's what I thought.
Unintended consequence.
The Plains of Armegeddan, just outside of Haifa.
The "Roadmap to Peace" runs through Jerusalem.
So says Mr Blair, Baker and Company.
Closing the straits would result in a remarkable shift of voting patterns at the UN Security Council by France and China, and there would suddenly be a dearth of EU commentary about how the hyperpuissance militaire Américaine is the most dangerous threat to world peace.
ReplyDeleteRedadtor, it could have that affect. It would take a couple of years but a Big Move would be Possible.
ReplyDeleteIt still isn't going to happen. The world would tut - tut if Israel attacked Iran's Nuke program, just like they did when Israel hit Iraq's Beshaer Reactor, but the world would get seriously pissed if Israel hit the oil fields, and especially if they did it without hitting the Nukes.
No, Redaktor, Israel will go after the nukes, if it goes after anything. However, to be honest, with Ohlmert and Rice working the same problem, I have my doubts about anything getting done, especially with Dubya having his tail in the crack real good.
One last thing: remember this, Israel, also, is an "Oil Importer."
ReplyDeleteDon't forget to imagine a world without Iranian pressure in the jihad. Iraq would flower under its own power, and the jihad will be back in awe of them big mean muthers.
ReplyDeleteYes, redaktor, them insurance companies and the reciprients of the cargo, it will concern them as well.
ReplyDeleteThose be the Indians, French and Chinese. All our dear friends and trading partners, they will seek remedy as supply dries up.
I am glad that you foresee no unitended consequence. My powers as a seer must be less accomplished then thine.
God, Buddy, I'd love to see it; I really, really would. I just have my doubts. Maybe, I'm wrong.
ReplyDeleteShakespeare said do not take counsel of your fears. Good advice, especially since we're f**ked for sure the other way--just a little slower.
ReplyDeleteI believe that the alternate fuels will get a big boost in the next few years. This is our second go 'round with gas as a problem (potentially this time so far) and now there are enough (I can't believe I'm about to say this) Democrats who have an alternate fuel constituency to get big oil to move on the issue. Particularly if they take the WH in '08.
ReplyDeleteOf course that might be offset by all the other horrors they may visit on us.
Rufus has really opened my eyes to the potentialities of alternate fuels and huzzahs for him are in order, huzzah,huzzah,huzzah.
If you'll turn on CNBC, tomorrow, you'll see the most amazing fluctuations in the price of a barrel of oil caused by the smallest of happenstances.
ReplyDeleteIt's never about the value of a particular barrel of oil, or shipment, but what it says about the future supply.
Old farts like me (not me, but like me) are sitting at home and playing the oil market through ETF's. Hedge funds are betting Trillions, daily, on the oil markets. Even, Pension funds are getting in the act, putting some oil in their portfolios.
It's the bubble 90s all over again.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteIsrael massively attacks Iran, w/ nukes to be effective, or not.
ReplyDeleteIran closes the Straits with Silkworm terror
The Chinese or French or Russians or Iranian/NorK react with a nonproportional response against Israel.
If the reaction comes from Iran, the consequence will be as intended.
From another actor, well that'll be somethin' to watch now, wouldn't it?
I highly doubt Iran will attack oil shipping in the Gulf because that would be an act of war towards other parties not involved, and that could invite a coalition of new foes setting off fireworks all over Iran.
ReplyDeleteIsarael has to measure those risks, for sure, rat. against what she knows is coming if she sits.
ReplyDeleteDR,
ReplyDeleteI think it's too hard for mankind to factor in what I agree with you on, and that is unintended consequences. It's chaos theory with a chain saw. (what the hell does that mean? I don't know I just wanted to fit in chaos theory and chainsaw. We'll ok you did it,now move on)
I always harken back to Apollo
13. The scene where Ed Harris trashes the original flight plan and they do what the human brain does best..think about sex..no I mean think about work arounds.
The interested parties will lay claim against Israel, for the unprovoked preemptive attack.
ReplyDeleteComing to the defense of the Iranians.
Israel is, after all, just a "shitty little country" to the French. Even less to the Chinese or Russians.
You're welcome, Habu, You're welcome.
ReplyDeleteI'll be sending out prospectuses on my new venture shortly.
Rufus and Possumtaters "Go-Bog Juice."
I think we're all goin to make a killin.
If all you early investors would send $29.95, right now, (my kinkos bill is in need of a little ketching up) I'll give you first crack at this opportunity of a lifetime. If you send cash (no checks) I'll make that $25.00 even.
Don't miss out.
"...I'll send you crack, at the first oppurtunity" Well, ok, I've always wanted to "be a hep cat".
ReplyDeleteYou're stretching it a bit, don't you think, d'Rat. Anyway, it will done from sea, and no one will be able to say who it was that did it.
ReplyDeleteWithout over flying Iraq, buddy, the Israeli have no hope of success. Look again to Lebanon for the number of sorties flown, as well as the limited success of the strikes.
ReplyDeleteIf the Israeli go nuke, someone will take the opportunity to spank 'em. The target will be to tempting to resist.
All the tit for tat justification that Mohammed needed, granted for eternity. Or a chip with the Sauds to be cashed in by a major player
"Crack's" okay; that was my Second Choice.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if all of those Philadelphia, and N Virginia Jews that voted Democrat thought this part of it through?
ReplyDeleteIt depends, rat. If the Iran regime falls, the world will forget achmadinejade in a trice, and start dealing with the successor--the future oil supplier. Achmadin will join Hitler as a total f**k up. This scenario will be laid out for all them big players just beforehand.
ReplyDeleteRight--it's gut check time. measure the risks, then go.
Not to mention the ones in St Louis, and Kansas City, and, also, in Clay Shaw's district.
ReplyDeleterufus, no, they didn't think it thru because it was a hidden issue--lost behind GWB "incompetence".
ReplyDeleteNo, I do not think I'm streching very far, not at all, really.
ReplyDeleteThere are only 6 million Israeli, not a grand price to pay for control of all the oil in the World, so to speak.
From Mr Putins' point of view.
After all Mr Stalin killed close to 20 million Russians for far less reason.
What would be the US response to such a fait acompli?
Genocide was accepted in Rowanda and today, in Darfur. What's another in the big scheme of things, anyway? I can hear Mr Baker, even now.
Get on board the Peace Train.
The Regime in Iran will not "fall" buddy, it's organic, like the Baathists in Iraq.
ReplyDeleteStill carzy after all these years.
i don't think America will follow that. It will be Cuban Crisis again. "Go ahead, then, mutherf88ker, shoot".
ReplyDeleteIt all depends on the presentation, rat. there is some degree of dissension even now. You yourself not long ago held out hope for Shah junior.
ReplyDeleteIndeed I did. Those hopes have fallen on hard times, as the conditions based schedule did not materialize, last August, as the young Shag predicted/ proposed.
ReplyDeleteTo my mind that makes it an ever more difficult mission to accomplish. If the Israeli nuke Iran, all bets are off. The "Rules" will be rewritten, and the US will not have pen in hand.
That's what I think. The French and Russians, as well as the Turks are already in the Levant.
We are a ways away, on the other side of Syria, in a sea of Shita, so to speak
They're there, but not in strength. Expendables, depending on the play.
ReplyDeleteDR,
ReplyDeleteOf course it's all speculative but I don't think China or Russia will defend Iran in an attacked scenario. If they intended to that they would have made it known to the world by now that they have mutual defense treaties in place.
Russia has plenty of oil for their immediate needs and Israel has no intention of taking anyones oil fields, and the world knows that. Hell a few years ago they offered Yasser 98% of all he wanted and he walked away.
But I believe the probability of a strike on Iran is VERY high given their hostile intent and pursuit of the bomb to turn intent into action.
we would be in SUCH better position if we had started building about 6 new armored divisions on Sept 12,'01, and called them the "Africa Corps" or something, and stationed the Corp in one of the Emirates or Kuwait, facing northeast.
ReplyDeleteNo, the "Alexander Corp".
ReplyDeleteThe Good News is, We'll come out of an oil shock faster than any other country that's severely affected (I'm thinking mostly, Europe, but to a lesser extent Japan, and Korea.)
ReplyDeleteWhile Europe has brilliant scientists, they are "studying the alternative fuels strategy to death," and the third world just doesn't have the organic investment necessary for rapid growth, but in the U.S. the Farmers, and investors are diving in, making it up as they go along.
Brazil out-produced us in Ethanol Last Year, and next year we'll probably double them in spite of the fact that they are increasing their production probably 20% a year.
Japan and Korea are good folks, but their economies are just too rigid for explosive growth in something new.
PRC needs the sea lanes more than anyone, and is years away from challenging the USN in blue water.
ReplyDeleteWhy telegraph intent, when the mission is the destruction of Israel?
ReplyDeleteWhat is needed is provocation.
For US against Iran
For the rightous against Israel.
The French, I'd not put it beyond them. Lose a platoon in Lebanon, a nonproportional response. They'd have all the Mohammedan trade concessions they'd ever dreamed of in return.
Even the Sauds themselves, with some Paki warheads. The genie would be out of the bottle, tit for tat, forever 'til the end.
The Israeli would be living on borrowed time, more so then they already are, with the Iranian threats.
The new reality would be worse.
Plus, the day we embargo their goods, they have 600 million unemployed. Hell to pay.
ReplyDeleteIt's da Bears and da Giants ..seee ya at halftime....
ReplyDeleteGrossman was a great Gator QB and I was a great Florida partier so hey..gotta watch..
Of course my freshman year at UF the quarterback was Steve Spurrier.
halftime..if you're headed to bed, rest well my compadres.
Rufus ..I'm look'in at that Go-Bog Juice. Sounds like a winner.
Russia wants to legally, peacefully, take the capital out of western europe, and has the way to do it, without war. They will want to milk the deal they already have cooked in.
ReplyDeleteHas anybody yet considered that Bush and Ohlmert might sign a mutual defense pact? In return, Israel doesn't attack Iran, and we give them all the credit for missile defense systems their little hearts desire.
ReplyDeleteTargets of opportunity, buddy, can't let those slide on by.
ReplyDeletePoor boys from the KGB understand that, those born with a silver shoe in their mouth, well Ms Richards lost, didn't she.
Better get that cash in the mail right away, Habu. Just stick a fiver and a twenty in an envelope and send it to (wait a minute, does this have to go through my parole officer?)
ReplyDeleteI'll get back to you, later. Good luck to the Bears.
Senate Ratification, now that'd be an interesting debate for '07, wouldn't it?
ReplyDeleteWhat you're missing, rat, is that Israel is already backed into a corner, with no way out. She ain't gonna just roll over and die. Past that fact, all else is commentary, as they say.
ReplyDeleteThe main thing (basically, the only thing) Russia's worried about is their sizable business deal in the Iranian Reactor(s.) Somebody will, somehow, some way, have to make them whole.
ReplyDeletewe could slow down the NATO encroachment.
ReplyDeleteThat pretty low-life politics, tho.
ReplyDeleteI do not miss it, buddy, it just does not matter.
ReplyDeleteThe numbers tell the tale, if not this round, then the next or the one after that.
Syria, Eygpt, Iran, the proxies France, Russia and HB.
There are 5.2 million jewish Israeli and 5.3 million Palistinians, 'tween the river and the sea.
The population of Palestinians living in Israel, the Occupied (2004)Gaza Strip, Occupied East Jerusalem and rest of the Occupied West Bank combined now exceeds the number of Israeli Jews, a U.S. government report has revealed.
The Palestinian population stands at over 5.3 million while the Jewish population stands at 5.2 million.
The figures come from the U.S. State Department's annual Country Reports on Human Rights Practices for 2004. The report provided population figures for each of these territorial units separately but failed to connect all the dots to arrive at the explosive new demographic reality that an Israeli Jewish minority now rules over a larger number of Palestinians living between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River.
The section on Israel and the Occupied Territories states that the population of Israel stands at 6.8 million, of whom 5.2 million are Jews, 1.3 million Arabs and another 290,000 are other minorities.
Let alone the bordering countries and their populations, Lebanon and Jordan. Egypt and Syria.
A sea of Araby and a tiny ship of state.
Heh. I can't believe you'd play along with desert burka. I guess you live and learn.
ReplyDeleteI wonder how many Jewish fellows belong to the "Skull & Bones"
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ReplyDeleteWith Mr Baker and the 41 team back in charge of US Foreign Policy,
ReplyDeleteredacktor takes offense, but has no facts to dispute.
He dislikes the scenario proposed.
So it's back to PC name calling for him. The attempt to orstricize and thus limit the debate.
So bush league.
Every solution is short-term, you're right.
ReplyDeleteLong-term, need a peace somehow. But the short term is what has to be dealt with, next minute.
It's a non-sequiter, anyway--nobody lets themself be murdered on the grounds that mother nature is gonna get 'em eventually anyway.
Arafat always said that the palestinian womb was his greatest weapon.
ReplyDeleteWe Have decided to let them into THE WTO you know. That means they get MFN trade status. They would probably like to have a little piece of Boeing, and maybe GE, and Exxon. just a "taste," you know?
ReplyDeleteWell, redactor gets no madder'n you would if he were dispassionately discussing the Chihuahuaians taking Arizona and putting the rat tribe to the sword.
ReplyDeleteThe Peace of the Dead
ReplyDeleteor the Peace of the Victor, buddy
Those are the choices available.
The downside to the "Long War" is that the US lacks grit. Called it the first day I heard the new meme.
Not much has changed, the prior predictions are falling into place.
Nov '07, that'll be the target date for US to be already leaving Iraq. The pullout will be underway by August. The window of opportunity for escalation closing.
Keep those wet dream fantasies to yourself. Without oil money, Jihadi demographics will vanish like green in the Sahara.
ReplyDeleteI can't believe all that great work on trade deals with Peru, and Colombia are shot all to hell. What a bad break.
ReplyDeleteColombia would have been a big break for our soybean farmers. And, all the Dem Senators from Soy producing states are against it. Go figure.
The same "physics" that will work in the Sahara will work in Sonora, desert burka.
ReplyDeleterufus said:
ReplyDeleteThe main thing (basically, the only thing) Russia's worried about is their sizable business deal in the Iranian Reactor(s.) Somebody will, somehow, some way, have to make them whole.
Putin is busy these days making the Soviet Union whole.
Unions, rufus--they don't go for all this free trade shit, and they will get their pound of flesh now. Been in the desert a long time. Can you say "trouble"?
ReplyDeleteHe's busy all right, but he's tacking against a pretty stiff breeze.
ReplyDeleteAt least the European Socialists are busy bringing trading partners in; our socialists are busy keeping them out.
ReplyDeleteRedactor, rat has signed the whole west off to the Mohammadans already--don't take it personally. The modus operandi is to get readers to face the worst-case scenarios, and think about them. A good G2 man.
ReplyDeleteI share 'em with the world, a good dry hump.
ReplyDeleteLimit the oil monies, that'll be the day. Don't hold your breath, or you'll be dead, from the waiting.
The US had its opportunity to "roll on" it decided not to. I thought it a bad choice, but it was not my day to decide.
Now i just get to comment on the obvious facts and the untold back stories that abound.
The Israeli are between a rock and a hard place, and my choice of costume will not change that. How many Palistinian refugees are there in the UN canps in Lebanon, sixty years on?
The Israeli are playing in a fixed game, marks in a sea of sharks.
I sure did not write the rules they play by.
Publius Pundit has some heart-breaking posts on this. I don't even have the energy to post them.
ReplyDeleteBuddy,
ReplyDeleteThat's why I call him desert burka. No fighting spirit left.
the rat package oughtta come with a handy wrist-razor, tho, for sure.
ReplyDeleteyep, rufus--i tried to read publius the other day, and just could not stand it. what a major f88ked up deal we done did.
ReplyDeleteWhatever the number, we wouldn't hesitate killing twice that number. You see, desert burka, the only thing protecting that demographic is oil. And once that's gone, so are they.
ReplyDeletethe election just keeps washing over me in waves. don't really know what to do. the trainloads of destructors steaming into DC is just freaking heartbreaking.
ReplyDeleteI've got lots of fighting spirit, amigo, tell me, where is the fight?
ReplyDeleteAnd with whom?
The Religion of Peace? I think not.
Mr Bush has made that clear, my Country is not at War with Islam.
Iran, no, no war there. Not even after ample provocation, smae with Syria. Darfurs' Mohammedan genocide, not my concern says Mr Bush. The UN will surfice.
Israel is not my country and faces no US enemy. Why the US funds the Palisinian Authority, how could we be at war with them?
Hezbollah is part of the new Iraqi Government, one of our devout allies in Peace.
When the Mohammedans are the Enemy, I'll fight 'em, but today they are not. LAst month the Ramadan Fast was broken with Feasting at the White House.
My fighting spirit is fine.
The US has, by Law. no dog in the fight. I do not write the Laws, either, just comment upon them.
well, that's an interpretation of the official line. But Hez is in fact your enemy, and Israel is in fact your ally.
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ReplyDeleteI just think, that in the end, the Israeli will go the route of the Shah, or the Catholics in 'Nam, if they depend upon US for the existence.
ReplyDeleteSame tune, different lyric.
The US had not declared war on the Soviets either. So what does that mean?
ReplyDeleteWell, Buddy, I might be coming down your way. My son, and grandson, live in Houston, and my daughter is getting ready to move down there, shortly. I'm trying to talk her into looking into the bio-fuels industry, down there; I think it's got some real promise down in your neck of the woods.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I'm going to go down and see if I can pick up some cheap scrub land not too far from the ocean. Twenty or thirty miles. I think it might be a gold mine for the kids, and grand-kids. That should keep me occupied for a few months. Then, we'll take another look around, and see if things look any better.
We did not shoot them, we talked.
ReplyDeleteThe Soviets became Russians and the Game goes on. The threat remains the same, though.
The Russians are still armed and MAD takes care of the rest.
Mr Olmert says that option is not available to Israel, he should know.
The options that depend upon US, he should be wary of. Mr Diem or the Shah could give him adequate advise on how fast the tide can turn, in regards the USA.
Any US President would sacrifice Tel Aviv to save New York. Count on it. Hell, look to Coventry, not Dresden for the proper example of Allied thinking in WWII.
You'll like it, the Texas coast south of Corpus is pretty open--not much development, even in this day and age. I'm in the book, rufus, in DS (you know the town, west of Austin). Just a mile up the hill off hwy 165, two miles south of the hwy 290 junction. If you get up this way, gimme a holler. I'm out in the sticks a way, but not all that fur off the beaten path. we'll drink a cold un and cuss rat.
ReplyDeleteMaybe it'll all work out. Maybe the Dems'll be looking to '08 enough to get through all this. Have to admit, tho, the nat'l security & economy issues--*the* issues--don't seem to interest voters unless both issues are in the shit can. (*sigh*)
ReplyDeletedesert burka,
ReplyDeleteIran without oil is like a peacock with its feathers tarred. A sorry specimen. Iran is not a player. They drew a tie against Iraq. And that's only because they used the most desperate measures at that. Neither is Iran going to overrun Israel with Hezzbbollah. France or Russia are not going to nuke Israel because of some accident in Iranian oil facilities. Afghanistan was returning Soviet boys dead in the hundred of thousands. So these fantasies are your own private fantasies. Though it was amusing to see others entertain you on them.
Let's don't cuss Rat, and Habu, too much. We might be joining up under them in the Militia if this thing gets too far out of whack.
ReplyDeleteBesides, you never know when you'll need a loan :)
That's the spirit, redactor--can't do squat without the spirit!
ReplyDeletehey, you're right--might need that loan!
ReplyDeleteIran without oil is like a peacock with its feathers tarred. A sorry specimen.
ReplyDeleteAn interesting line, Redactor. I still can't agree with your main premise, but a great line none the less. Something to think about.
Well, I'm whupped. G'Nite everyone. G'nite possumtater, whereever you are.
ReplyDeleteWe'll see what the market thinks, tomorrow, now that it's had a chance to think about it for a week.
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ReplyDelete