COLLECTIVE MADNESS


“Soft despotism is a term coined by Alexis de Tocqueville describing the state into which a country overrun by "a network of small complicated rules" might degrade. Soft despotism is different from despotism (also called 'hard despotism') in the sense that it is not obvious to the people."

Monday, January 18, 2010

Brown Set to Beat Coakley in Massachusetts. Make it Happen.




Brown Has 9.6% Lead in New Poll
InsideMedford

Brown supporters focused most on pocketbook issues, Coakley supporters on healthcare reform, undecided voters split

A poll conducted by the Merriman River Group (MRG) and InsideMedford.com indicates that Scott Brown leads Martha Coakley 50.8% – 41.2% in the contest to fill the seat of the late Senator Ted Kennedy. Liberty Party candidate Joe Kennedy pulls in just 1.8% support, while 6.2% of voters are still not sure. Brown and Coakley both have most of their supporters locked in. 98% of both candidate’s supporters say they are definitely or probably going to vote for their candidate. In contrast, 22% of Kennedy’s supporters are just leaning toward him, suggesting that Brown and Coakley may both want to take aim at swaying those voters.

Not surprisingly, nearly all of Coakley’s supporters approve of President Obama’s job performance, while three-quarters of Brown’s supporters disapprove. Coakley may see a glimmer of hope in the fact that more than two-thirds of undecided voters approve of the president’s job performance while only 6% disapprove, especially in light of the president’s swing through the state to campaign for her later today.

47% of Brown’s supporters say that taxes, jobs, and the economy represent the most important issue to them in this race, while half of Coakley’s supporters say that healthcare reform is most important to them. Undecided voters are nearly evenly split between the two issues—40% say they’re most concerned with taxes, jobs, and the economy with 37% saying that healthcare reform that most concerns them. “For Coakley to have a chance, she needs to convince voters that the Democratic party’s agenda for the economy is the right one, and she needs to do it fast,” said MRG’s executive director, Matt Fitch.

The recent dust-up between the candidates over abortion laws seems to have had minimal impact on the race. Only 8% of Brown’s supporters and 5% of Coakley’s supporters say it’s the most important issue to them.

The endorsement in Medford on January 7 of Martha Coakley by members of Senator Ted Kennedy’s family appears to have had little effect on most voters and to have backfired with others. 55% said that it was not important to them, but 27% said it made them less likely to vote for Coakley, while only 18% said it made them more likely to vote for her. As for undecided voters, more than two-thirds said the endorsement was not important. “The Kennedy family endorsement seems to have hurt more than it helped Coakley, despite the popularity of the Kennedys in the state and in Medford,” said Allison Goldsberry, Editor of InsideMedford.com.

What seems to tip the race in Brown’s favor most is his popularity among Moderates, Independents, and men, and Coakley’s lack of an advantage among women. Brown nearly doubles Coakley’s total among Moderates, 62% – 32%, and has an even bigger margin among Independents, 64% – 26%. There’s also a one-way gender effect that favors Brown, who holds a nearly two-to-one lead over Coakley among men while women are split evenly between the two candidates. Brown does best among white voters, while Coakley leads among non-whites, suggesting that minority turnout may play a crucial role on election day. Brown is also leading among all age groups.



237 comments:

  1. Turn out is key, to any election.

    There is going to plenty of walkin' around money, bein' spent. Today and tomorrow, better believe that.

    That Mr Brown won't be spending much of it, also a reality.

    If the Dems cannot hold Mass, why that would really be something to see.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Crony Capitalism Chicago Style

    linearthinker said...

    Two snakes sleeping under the same green rock.

    Green stimulus.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Obaby, and Coakley couldn't even fill up a 3,000 seat auditorium at Northeastern Univ., yesterday.

    I think Brown might win this thing. That would be truly scarifying to the Dems.

    Brown is looking, from a distance, like one of the best candidates that Pubs have found in years. And, he sure does have Great Timing.

    ReplyDelete
  4. DR,

    If you have a link wherein the ADL is quoted as you state, please provide same. Specifically, I would like to see where Foxman or anyone attached called the "tea party" activists NAZI or KKK.

    If that is your interpretation of the ADL position, please so state.

    Mon Jan 18, 08:46:00 AM EST

    ReplyDelete
  5. very useful article. I would love to follow you on twitter. By the way, did you learn that some chinese hacker had busted twitter yesterday again.
    [url=http://amazon.reviewazone.com/]Wanda[/url]

    ReplyDelete
  6. allen said...
    "DR,

    If you have a link wherein the ADL is quoted as you state, please provide same. Specifically, I would like to see where Foxman or anyone attached called the "tea party" activists NAZI or KKK.

    If that is your interpretation of the ADL position, please so state.
    "

    also, please include evidence that

    "doug appears shocked, to the core of his being, that there are those empowered by our government to do domestic surveillance."

    ReplyDelete
  7. Yep, Doug, if we cover 30 Million more people the folks with coverage will, almost definitely, have to wait a little longer to see the Doc. At least for awhile. I think we can "stipulate" to the factfulness of that statement.

    Those parents whose childrens' lives might be saved by this healthcare availability Thank YOu for your patience.

    ReplyDelete
  8. interesting article. I would love to follow you on twitter. By the way, did anyone hear that some chinese hacker had hacked twitter yesterday again.
    [url=http://amazon.reviewazone.com/]Tammy[/url]

    ReplyDelete
  9. I wonder what in the Hell is going on with Rasmussen?

    He had nothing but an outdated poll on Mass.

    Now his frickin site has been down for 24 hours!

    ReplyDelete
  10. Anonymous is posting links to Wanda, and Tammy.

    What a bar tart.

    ReplyDelete
  11. No, Rufus, if you supplant Market Economics with Central Planning, the results are gauranteed to be FUCKED!

    ReplyDelete
  12. Rufus remains to the left of Mass.
    Democrats!

    ReplyDelete
  13. I guess we want to roll back Medicare then, eh Doug?

    ReplyDelete
  14. View from the Left

    Looks like the Rasmussen poll on the January 19th special election for Massachusetts Senate was not a fluke. From Public Policy Polling:

    "Because of the heavy interest we'll try to get our Massachusetts numbers out over the weekend. But because we've already conducted most of the interviews for it here are some of the major storylines we're seeing:

    At this point a plurality of those planning to turn out oppose the health care bill. The massive enthusiasm gap we saw in Virginia is playing itself out in Massachusetts as well. Republican voters are fired up and they're going to turn out. Martha Coakley needs to have a coherent message up on the air over the last ten days that her election is critical to health care passing and Ted Kennedy's legacy- right now Democrats in the state are not feeling a sense of urgency.
    "

    Scott Brown's favorables are up around 60%, a product of his having had the airwaves to himself for the last week.

    ReplyDelete
  15. I'd like to roll back ALL Socialist Programs, Comrade Rufus!

    ReplyDelete
  16. Whit: Anonymous is posting links to Wanda, and Tammy. What a bar tart.

    Wanda is his latex lady. Tammy is in the spare room waiting for a patch and reinflation.
    --
    Brown is pulling ahead because this is a referendum on socialized medicine, and Massachusetts already has it. Ninety-eight percent of residents there already have insurance. Brown said, "We're going to be basically paying for our plan, and then we're going to be subsidizing Nebraska and Louisiana . . . boy, that's a real bargain."

    ReplyDelete
  17. ...being that socialism has such a great record.

    ...like Hugo the Pig nationalizing everything, including Frog Factories.

    ReplyDelete
  18. "We're going to be basically paying for our plan, and then we're going to be subsidizing Nebraska and Louisiana . . . boy, that's a real bargain."
    ---
    And Hawaii gets to lose a great system for der Fuhrer.

    And we ALL subsidize Unions at the expense of free market capitalism.

    ReplyDelete
  19. Actually, Doug, the Union exemption only lasts until 2018. If it's even Constitutional to start with.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Eventually, Doug, we have to get health coverage for the poor, and the sick. That's all.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Yeah, the SEIU is aware of that, that's why they are campaigning for Brown!

    They realise "Healthcare" is, ultimately, an equal opportunity, disaster.

    ReplyDelete
  22. rufus said...

    "Eventually, Doug, we have to get health coverage for the poor, and the sick. That's all."
    ---
    Compassion based on falsehoods is no compassion at all.
    Socialism does not work, wherever it's tried.

    ReplyDelete
  23. When there is no American Healthcare,
    Canadians will have no access to modern healthcare.

    ReplyDelete
  24. 106. Mr. X:

    I don’t see a single person who looks like they’re under the age of 40 in that crowd of Dems behind Obama (Fox News clip on the Gateway Pundit site), and it’s heavy on well…heavy set, middle aged women, white and black. I feel a Whiskey rant coming on about The One activating the fantasies of middle aged lady bureaucrats while destroying the blue collar jobs of their working class ex-husbands…

    At least in video of Russian political events I see a few slim twentysomething blondes, of which Russia has in abundance, near Medvedev or Putin. Hell, some of them get seats in the Duma. So what gives? When did America become a country where a middle aged elite gets to so blatantly discriminate against the young, from jacking up housing prices in Blue Cities to empowering the all-important credit score which stays artifically low for all of those who never missed a payment but neglected to start their credit history at the age of ten? Why? I thought America was supposed to be a young country but so far what have twentysomethings received from Hope and Change? The highest unemployment since WWII for those under 25…good luck getting married boys, or even moving out from Mom and Dad…

    Ivan is correct on WWII, and thanks to Teresita for urging fellow BCers to prevent Three Conjectures from becoming nukyulur war porn.

    ReplyDelete
  25. A little "Socialism" is not only a Good thing, Doug, it's absolutely Vital. Without a little "socialism" we'd be in another "Great Depression," right now.

    The Genius of the US has been, so far, Doug, a "Middle of the Road" system.

    ReplyDelete
  26. A brave union official endorses a commonsense reform to improve accountability.

    In what could prove a turning point in favor of education reform, American Federation of Teachers president Randi Weingarten came out in favor of considering student performance on standardized tests as one part of teacher evaluations. If Weingarten turns her words into real actions, and if the teachers’ unions follow Weingarten’s lead, it will improve teacher quality across the country.

    Support for using student test scores to evaluate teachers is a departure for Weingarten. Two years ago, when New York City planned to start using test scores as part of its teacher evaluations, it was Weingarten, then head of the city’s teachers’ union, who pushed state lawmakers to ban the city from doing so. The legislature caved. New York’s education reformers are working to eliminate the ban.

    ---

    In the last decade, researchers have developed statistical tools capable of measuring teachers’ independent contribution to their students’ learning, as reflected by their scores on standardized tests. When carefully applied, these measures can separate the influence of the teacher on a student’s test scores from the influences of other factors, such as the student’s background characteristics and even the quality of his home life.

    It’s true that test-score analysis, if used improperly, can do as much harm as good. And test scores alone are not broad enough to be used in isolation in evaluating teachers. Nonetheless, they are valuable tools for strengthening those evaluations and the employment decisions that might result.

    Randi Weingarten should be applauded for her decision to support the use of test scores to evaluate teachers. However, she is likely to face an uphill climb. While Weingarten’s AFT has shown itself open to some common-sense reforms, the nation’s largest teachers’ union, the National Education Association, has so far pursued a scorched-earth policy not only against using test scores in teacher evaluations, but also against more widely praised reforms such as the expansion of charter schools. It’s also unclear whether local AFT affiliates will be willing to follow their president. For instance, Weingarten’s replacement as president of New York City’s teachers’ union, Michael Mulgrew, has actively fought to keep the ban on using test scores to evaluate teachers.

    For the sake of America’s future, let’s hope that Randi Weingarten sticks to her brave words and that the broader teachers’-union community follows her lead.

    ReplyDelete
  27. Right on, Rufus!
    Sig Heil, Govt Sucks!

    ReplyDelete
  28. Without a little "socialism" we'd be in another "Great Depression," right now.

    Depression, recession. The distinction is blurred.

    ReplyDelete
  29. "Middle of the Road"
    Consists of giving to the rich to impoverish the poor.

    ReplyDelete
  30. Inland Empire buyers in SOCAL desiring to purchase at prices cheaper than renting are being denied access by banks selling to all-cash investors, while denying credit to qualified buyers.

    Brought to you by the Crony Govt/Wall St Alliance.

    ReplyDelete
  31. ...as the middle of the road govt provides banks free money to keep their shadow inventory of depreciated assets off the market.

    ReplyDelete
  32. Excellent Article from Morningstar

    This is the "real" problem. And, Obubba is completely ignoring it.

    ReplyDelete
  33. They're "misdirecting" you, right now, Doug. Whether some sort of Healthcare bill passes is not going to make any appreciable difference in your life, or mine.

    What happens with "Energy" could seriously fuck us up.

    ReplyDelete
  34. There is a guy in Texas that is now going to old "dry" fields and drilling in between old wells, it seems the space between them was over guessed...

    He's making a ton since there is MUCH oil still in these dry fields...

    Peak Oil? maybe maybe not...

    the internal combustion engine has not radically changed since it's invention, i would bet as fuel costs go up (200 a barrel) there will be technology that will be used to stretch a gallon of fuel...

    it's all price...

    ReplyDelete
  35. "Those parents whose childrens' lives might be saved by this healthcare availability Thank YOu for your patience."


    Ruf, if you want to push for socialized medicine that's fine. But no red herrings, please.

    You know there are programs out there covering uninsured children. In fact the existing CHIP program was expanded this year in January to cover an additional four million children, and pregnant mothers, as well as, legal allians with no waiting period.


    .

    ReplyDelete
  36. from Ruf's link:
    Are We Running Out of Oil?
    In a word, no. Yet we have essentially found all of the cheap oil. Since Colonel Drake first drilled for oil in Pennsylvania in 1859, the world has used about a trillion barrels of oil. Estimates vary widely, but there are at least another trillion barrels of conventional crude oil reserves and perhaps two or three times that much if you consider unconventional (and higher-cost) sources, such as oil sands and oil shale. We're not going to run out of oil overnight, but it's fair to say that the first trillion barrels we consumed were the cheapest, easiest-to-access reserves.


    We're not going to run out of oil onvernight, the Maldives aren't going to be inundated overnight and healthcare is not broken.

    ReplyDelete
  37. Excellent Video, Doug.

    BUT, that wasn't "socialism;" That was Genocide.

    In 2007 the US planted 91 million acres of corn, and had a Record Harvest of 13.1 Million Bushels.

    In 2009 the US planted 86 million acres of corn, and after a horrible growing/harvesting season Set a New Record of 13.2 Million Bushels, and 165 Bu/Acre. Corn is selling, today, for about six and a half cents/lb.

    ReplyDelete
  38. No Red Herrings, Q. I know Much more about it than you do. SCHIP, AND MEDICAID are, mostly, funded by the states, and the level of coverage varies immensely.

    I KNOW of young adults in Ms that are, literally, dying for lack of adequate healthcare.

    ReplyDelete
  39. Q, you can't convince me that something I've seen with my own eyes isn't true.

    ReplyDelete
  40. Of course everyone has to realize that the Republicans are going to hate this guy after he gets elected.

    He won't be Republican enough.

    ReplyDelete
  41. Quirk,
    Policy should be determined by anecdote, not by the lessons of history.

    ReplyDelete
  42. Deuce,
    He will be for me!
    W, never was, after Powell and Condi took the reins.
    (as Rufus remained his cheerleader!)

    ReplyDelete
  43. Many people become seriously dyslexic when dealing with large amounts of "zeros."

    Whether some guy in Texas can make a few million dollars pumping an extra ten, or twenty thousand barrels of oil/day is of no consequence to a world that has to bring probably 25Million more barrels/day online in the next 5 years.

    I'm bettin on $100/barrel oil by midsummer, and I wouldn't bet Against $120/barrel by the end of Summer.

    $120/Barrel is $3.50 + Gasoline territory.

    ReplyDelete
  44. Rufus,
    Because, if you are correct, Mississippi is a shithole,
    the rest of the nation should surrender their unsurpassed medical care?

    ReplyDelete
  45. I hereby appoint Rufus Energy Tsar,
    and forbid his ever becoming
    Healthcare Tsar!

    ReplyDelete
  46. rufus...I'm bettin on $100/barrel oil by midsummer, and I wouldn't bet Against $120/barrel by the end of Summer.

    $120/Barrel is $3.50 + Gasoline territory.


    hell I'm betting on $200 by fall...

    regardless of peak or no peak...

    war is brewing in the middle east.. Iran's output is in doubt... russia is in decline china is rationing fuel at the same time building more plants...

    clusterfuck....

    and oil will be going up regardless if we find more or not..

    china and india will be consuming much much more...

    ReplyDelete
  47. It's only "unsurpassed" if you can afford it, Doug. And, if you are an "average" American, w/o a job, and a Medical "Condition" you Can't afford it. There are about 30 Million (they, obviously, aren't All from Ms) that Can't afford it.

    ReplyDelete
  48. (I can afford dollar a pound corn!)

    ReplyDelete
  49. Deuce said...
    Of course everyone has to realize that the Republicans are going to hate this guy after he gets elected.



    I am going to love that he aint a democrat...

    I dont want to see a steamroller for either side of the coin..

    ReplyDelete
  50. Besides, your healthcare will only get better. The only difference is you are going to pay a little higher taxes. I've said all along that we are, collectively, going to have to pony up an extra $1500 to $2,000.

    ReplyDelete
  51. Rufus,

    We could BUY medical insurance for those folks for less than the cost of "reform" if we no longer had to pay a premium for unfunded services provided by govt healthcare, which is tacked on to everyone's bill now.

    ReplyDelete
  52. "Besides, your healthcare will only get better."

    ...and the Sun will rise in the East,
    and collectivist peasants will become rich.

    ReplyDelete
  53. How the fuck do you explain how centralizing a massive, complicated system will result in greater efficiency?

    (larger than the Chinese Army, costwise)

    ReplyDelete
  54. Cite one example where centralized control of a large system has worked.
    ...not to include, tenuously, the Military.

    ReplyDelete
  55. Rufus,
    The McNamera of US Healthcare.

    ReplyDelete
  56. Is anyone making the claim that it would be more efficient doug? I thought the prime reason for health care reform was to get everyone covered? I thought a secondary reason was to try to limit the ability of private insurers to gouge folk.

    ReplyDelete
  57. I like the way they gouge me, Ash, with competence, and modern technology.

    ReplyDelete
  58. Free everything for everyone never has, and never will, work.

    ...but we are so rich we could buy insurance for LEGAL CITIZENS, and preserve our excellent healthcare system.

    ...just as we could vastly improve education system by excluding illiterate illegals.

    ReplyDelete
  59. Deuce: Of course everyone has to realize that the Republicans are going to hate this guy after he gets elected. He won't be Republican enough.

    Thus he becomes the GOP front runner for President in 2012, after the likes of Dubya and McCain. The checkered-pants Republicans will probably run another teabagger for VP to avoid a conservative split.

    ReplyDelete
  60. Simple economics, Dougie-boy. You increase the number of potential buyers, and you will get more, and better, product. And, higher prices.

    I was selling policies that had IIRC a $10/day room benefit when Medicare was enacted. Also, Blue Cross, and Large Groups became the big thing about that time.

    Well, prices skyrocketed. But, so did the technology available. We live a lot longer now, and we're a lot healthier (at least, the ones that have insurance;) but we spend a lot more.

    An old boss (who I damned near bankrupted by selling too many policies that wouldn't lapse:) told me there were only 100 pennies in a dollar.

    Wise man, but he never considered the possibility of a salesman selling policies that refused to lapse. (All life, and health policies are priced on the probability of the policies lapsing before the policyholder getting sick, or dying. - Now, you know the secret.)

    ReplyDelete
  61. That's the secret of Social Security too.

    ReplyDelete
  62. T said...

    "I saw last night where you were jettisoned from the Elephant Bar Blog, the why isn’t important to me, what surprises me is that it took so long.

    Well, there’s always the backup persona.
    "
    ---
    What did Habu do,
    to e banned from the bar?

    ReplyDelete
  63. Let DC dictate Healthcare, and you get a better product.

    Smoke Crack, and your health will improve.

    Both true, beyond dispute.

    ReplyDelete
  64. See "The Hurt Locker" if you havent yet. It can be rented or bought thru Video on Demand service on your TV. Excellent Iraq War movie.

    I'm just sayin'

    ReplyDelete
  65. Doug, Habu is saying that he saw Teresita get ejected from the Elephant Bar.

    ReplyDelete
  66. ADLoBB

    Do a little surfing, within the ADLoBB domain, you'll find this, too:

    The July Tea Parties appeared to attract fewer attendees and less media attention but they did gain the attention of white supremacists, a number of whom joined protests in different places around the country. White supremacists saw the Tea Parties as an opportunity to express their own opposition to Obama and to see how receptive other protesters might be to their message.

    ReplyDelete
  67. With regards to the "birthers", the ADLoBB claims that individuals that are central to that group ply their trade on ... the Political Cesspool, a white supremacist Internet and AM radio show that regularly features white supremacists, Holocaust deniers, and other conspiracy theorists as guests.

    ReplyDelete
  68. ...health care debate...

    If “peak oil” is a problem, it pales in comparison to “peak medicine”. What do I mean?

    As this is written, there are a finite number of medical practitioners available to deliver health care. Many will not treat Medicare patients. Why? Are they heartless brutes, interested only in the bottom line? No. They are competent doctors, who refuse to let some ill educated clerk at the Medicare office tell them that they must meet, examine, treat and console 9 patients per hour (1pt/6.67min).

    In my small synagogue are six physicians. Each and every one is as kind as kind can be. Each and every one opposes the currently proposed legislation. Why? Are they all heartless, money grubbing XXXX? No. Each and every one, for example, knows that a competent, conscientious surgeon can perform only so many surgeries in a day. Under this legislation and its ultimate constraints on time and money, a surgery will become a shambles, peopled by unscrupulous profiteers. It is NOT possible to determine how long a neurosurgery will last. It is NOT possible to know how long a heart surgery will take.

    Unlike biofuel, there is no cheap substitute for highly trained medical professionals. Yes, I am aware that nurse practitioners (NP) and physicians assistants (PA) are being utilized (often at the very margin of legality). But ask yourself, “If I need an angioplasty, do I want a two year wunderknd NP or PA to take a run at it, or do I want a physician”? How about if the patient is your mother? How about if the patient is the president of the United States. Yeah, that’s what I thought.

    ReplyDelete
  69. Perhaps the most interesting question of the day:


    Is There An X Factor?
    Josh Marshall | January 18, 2010, 11:16AM

    It seems pretty clear now that the plan if Martha Coakley loses tomorrow is to get the House to pass the Senate bill with a promise of revisions in a separate bill, to be passed in the Senate through the reconciliation process. But here's the frightening question: if Scott Brown wins Ted Kennedy's senate seat, do all those Democratic votes in the House stay in place? Or does the shock of a Bay State upset jolt enough conservative Dems into refusing to vote for the Senate bill, even after they already voted for the more liberal House bill?

    That's the potential problem for which there's no potential Plan B.

    As a matter of politics, I have little doubt that even for Dems in marginal districts, it's actually the safer call for them to vote for the bill a second time. Because the key is they already voted for it once. And from a strategic position in their districts, that is all that counts. Saying, 'yes, I voted for it but, hey, when it came back from conference I refused to vote for it again and it never came to a vote and the legislation died!' just ain't a distinction anyone's Republican opponents are going to allow.

    I suspect it won't even cut it for those who actually voted no the first time. But it definitely won't work for those who already voted for it once. That's the lesson of 1994, the conservative and moderate Democrats who killed health care reform derived not an ounce of benefit for having done so. Indeed, they were slaughtered en masse.

    I have very little doubt that that analysis is correct. But that doesn't mean the members in question will see it that way.

    ReplyDelete
  70. DR,

    You made a claim about the ADL. It is your responsibility to make the link(s) to prove your claim.

    Now, if you just drew your own conclusions or stated a personal opinion, man-up and say so.

    You could also admit finding that Mr. Foxman et al were not so impolitic as to call those you claim injured either NAZI or KKK...Right?

    ReplyDelete
  71. "No Red Herrings, Q. I know Much more about it than you do."

    Jane...er..Rufus, you ignorant slut. What arrogance.



    .

    ReplyDelete
  72. I may be a an Arrogant Slut, but you don't hafta call me, JANE! :)

    It's just a fact, Q. I know it to be a fact by reading what you believe. (I kinda imagine you suspect it, also.)

    ReplyDelete
  73. We can train more Doctors. We can't bring back to life those who die from lack of healthcare.

    ReplyDelete
  74. Martin Luther King Day.

    I mentioned the book "America's Prophet" sometime back, but didn't get to Martin Luther King, who so openly used the exodus story, speaking of the mountain top even the day before he died.

    So from the Mayflower to King it's been a constant refrain in our country.

    Moses is America's prophet, and King was a great man for his people.

    Have a good MLK Day.

    I need to get a calendar, I thought the bank would be open today, and there would be mail delivery.

    ReplyDelete
  75. Oh, and my entire life there have always been a few doctors in every town that, at any given time, are boycotting Medicare, Medicaid, Blue Cross, Watermelon Wine, bowhunting bunnies, or "something."

    Usually, by the next year it's a "different" group that's doing the bellyaching. They, ALL, keep buying bigger houses, though.

    ReplyDelete
  76. The health care bill is a bunch of shit.

    I've said it all along, we need more doctors.

    Spend money on creating more teaching hospitals. The rest will follow.

    ReplyDelete
  77. I meant to say more medical schools, but we need more of both.

    ReplyDelete
  78. allen said:

    rat put up or shut up - Specifically, I would like to see where Foxman or anyone attached called the "tea party" activists NAZI or KKK.

    rat responds:The Influence of the Mainstream Media
    Although much of the recent anti-government anger has been generated by a combination of partisan politics, grass-roots activists, and extreme groups and movements, the mainstream media has also played a role in promoting anti-government anger and pandering to people who believe that the Obama administration is illegitimate or even fascistic.

    The most important mainstream media figure who has repeatedly helped to stoke the fires of anti-government anger is right-wing media host Glenn Beck, who has a TV show on FOX News and a popular syndicated radio show. While other conservative media hosts, such as Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity, routinely attack Obama and his administration, typically on partisan grounds, they have usually dismissed or refused to give a platform to the conspiracy theorists and anti-government extremists. This has not been the case with Glenn Beck. Beck and his guests have made a habit of demonizing President Obama and promoting conspiracy theories about his administration.

    On a number of his TV and radio programs, Beck has even gone so far as to make comparisons between Hitler and Obama and to promote the idea that the president is dangerous.

    On an August 2009 radio program, after claiming that President Obama was lying about his health-care plan, Beck told his audience to read Hitler’s Mein Kampf. Beck said that Hitler told Germans what he was going to do but no one listened. Beck then urged his audience not to make the same mistake with Obama: “Please America…take this man for what he says.”
    That same month, David Bellavia, a former army staff sergeant who wrote a book about his experiences as a soldier in Iraq, appeared as a guest on Beck’s TV show. Bellavia discussed the claim that President Obama was trying to create a “civilian national security force” and compared this to the efforts of Hitler and Saddam Hussein to create sinister military forces composed of political loyalists that answered only to them.
    On a July 2009 TV show, Beck said that President Obama is a “dangerous” man.
    In March 2009, as a guest on another FOX News show, Beck also promoted an anti-government conspiracy theory popular among right-wing extremists—that FEMA is building concentration camps to house “dissidents.” Beck declared that he could not debunk the theory. Before introducing the topic of FEMA camps on that show, Beck claimed that the United States was “headed towards socialism, totalitarianism beyond your wildest imagination.” Later, he also promoted the FEMA camps conspiracy theory on his own show. After much controversy, Beck later backed away from the FEMA camps theory. The FEMA episode, however, is a good example of Beck’s key role as a “fearmonger-in-chief,” using constant laments such as “I fear for my country” to create a sense of anxiety about and hostility towards the government in his audience.
    These kinds of claims from Beck create an intersection between the mainstream and the extreme. They play an important role in drawing people further out of the mainstream, making them more receptive to the more extreme notions and conspiracy theories.

    ReplyDelete
  79. DR said...

    "Do a little surfing".

    I did find this use of "NAZI" and "KKK" on a non-ADL site. Those epithets were directed by a XXX at a'Q and "Jewish" lawyers who defend terrorists.

    That wasn't what you had in mind, though, was it?

    We Jews know that the Al Qaeda website calls for radical Moslems to bomb synagogues and shoot Jews all across the United States. Yet, Robert C Gottlieb a Jewish attorney is now defending those very same Al Qaeda Islamic Nazis just arrested in Queens...

    ReplyDelete
  80. That was "ignorant slut", Ruf, as proven by your statement:

    "It's just a fact, Q. I know it to be a fact by reading what you believe. (I kinda imagine you suspect it, also.)"

    Arrogant slut? Well, yea, maybe that too.


    .

    .

    ReplyDelete
  81. For Bob, concerning your desire to shine a light on the Near Death Experience, a quote from William Faulkner in "Ad Astram":

    A man sees further looking out of the dark upon the light than a man does in the light and looking out upon the light.

    ReplyDelete
  82. Sounds like Beck is WARNING us about his fears that OBAMA is a dangerous person....

    Hardly what rat had claimed:

    Foxman or anyone attached called the "tea party" activists NAZI or KKK.

    Rat is the true "rodent of misdirection" again...

    ReplyDelete
  83. bob said...
    Martin Luther King Day.

    I mentioned the book "America's Prophet" sometime back, but didn't get to Martin Luther King, who so openly used the exodus story, speaking of the mountain top even the day before he died.

    So from the Mayflower to King it's been a constant refrain in our country.

    Moses is America's prophet, and King was a great man for his people.




    I'd rather see a Moses Day than a MLK day...

    ReplyDelete
  84. Happy MLD day to you too, Bob.

    ReplyDelete
  85. rufus said...

    "We can train more doctors..."

    Right...it only takes gobs of money, intelligence, aptitude and about twenty years training...hey, no problem, just like going to work at the Toyota plant...

    Yep, this is going to be a FUBAR of Biblical proportions.

    ReplyDelete
  86. As of early this morning the black armbands and crepe paper were being readied. Some do remain optimistic, or at least desperately hopeful, on the GOTV element. But everyone's aware of the political significance of the loss of the Kennedy seat.

    Add to this the circular firing squad that has not waited on the outcome.

    Even should Coakley eke out a win, that circular firing squad will continue. There will be no peace between what John Cole calls the Emo Progressives, the PUMAs, and the Obamabots.




    We've wondered whether the GOP would have hung together like it did, and Bush received a second term, absent 9/11. Would the fracturing of the Party have occurred much sooner than it did without what was to become the centerpiece of Bush's tenure?

    Jonah Goldberg once quipped that GWB "is a conservative because he says he is." In the end, however, this realization only fully came into play when he was on his way out and McCain was the nominee.

    GWB and to a lesser extent the GOP were, it appears in hindsight, assisted by an accident of history which overrode serious political divisions among the Republican body politic.

    Pat Buchanan himself in 2004 urged (persuasively I might add) disenchanted Republicans to "come home." And John Kerry was, to many in the nearly monolithically Republican MIC with vivid memories, who were angry about the prosecution of the war, the worst wartime candidate possible.

    Anyway, Obama and the Democratic Party have no such advantage now. There is nothing to paper over stark divisions. There is no practical purpose uniting enough. There is no discipline.

    ReplyDelete
  87. You guys need to All get it through your heads: If you follow the extremists from EITHER SIDE they will have you killing each other (while you're not busy buying "their" books, and sending "them" money.

    Never, ever pay any attention to any group whose reason for being is to promote an "Agenda." It doesn't matter if it's a Political Agenda, a Social Agenda, or a Religious Agenda. Their "Raison D'etra" is to keep you mad, and sending money.

    ReplyDelete
  88. rufus said...

    "They, ALL, keep buying bigger houses, though."

    Bravo! Your honesty is refreshing.

    Now, that is about the best explanation you could have given for your passionate advocacy and urgency, lust.

    ReplyDelete
  89. and, apparently, you need a super-majority to get a bill passed...

    ...who needs gov'mint anyway?

    ReplyDelete
  90. D'you mean, I'm "Hot for Healthcare?"

    Sorry, I'm purely "Heterosexual."

    :)

    ReplyDelete
  91. By the by: Doesn't Israel have "Universal Health Care?"

    ReplyDelete
  92. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  93. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  94. Israel has universal health insurance..

    ReplyDelete
  95. Mon Jan 18, 07:55:00 AM EST

    This is when DR, again, intruded his prejudices into an unrelated thread.

    It happens again and again, without a word of complaint by those who are terribly offended when XXXX take the field in defense.

    ReplyDelete
  96. Israel is not a far comparison...

    In Israel the vast majority of nurses, doctor and trauma care givers have been developed from a society under constant war like circumstances.

    In Israel, doctors dont zip around high society in flashy sports cars making 12 million a year.

    They actually perform

    It aint a perfect system, but the country has been akin to a mash unit on steroids....

    but Israel aint American and it's not fair to use Israel as an example of what America should do.

    ReplyDelete
  97. rufus said...

    By the by: Doesn't Israel have "Universal Health Care?"


    ...................and?

    ReplyDelete
  98. Allen,

    In all fairness to the "others" they ignore the rodent..

    they dont feed the troll...

    they give nothing to the rat....

    ReplyDelete
  99. So, it's okay for poor "Jews" to have healthcare, but not for poor "Americans." Is that about it?

    ReplyDelete
  100. Yes, the Rat is being ignored, but not for his anti-Israel content. If anything, such talk needs to be confronted, just not by me, and he already knows why, so 'nuff said.

    ReplyDelete
  101. It happens again and again, without a word of complaint by those who are terribly offended when XXXX take the field in defense.

    Mon Jan 18, 02:30:00 PM EST

    Do you ever get a little weary of this, allen?

    Rat has been confronted in his prejudices here at the Bar any number of times, and the unspoken consensus seems to be that doing so is perfectly fruitless.

    Whether he hammers away like he does simply because he knows it gets under your saddle, or because it really occupies his waking thoughts, any and all challenges have netted precisely squat.

    ReplyDelete
  102. So, Israel with a GDP per Capita of $28,000.00 can afford healthcare for all, but the US with a GDP/capita of $46,000.00 Can't?

    ReplyDelete
  103. rufus said...
    So, it's okay for poor "Jews" to have healthcare, but not for poor "Americans." Is that about it?

    That's Israeli's

    ReplyDelete
  104. rufus said...
    So, it's okay for poor "Jews" to have healthcare, but not for poor "Americans." Is that about it?

    Move to Israel, you will get free health care and taxes up the ass, plus you will be legal to be hunted by arabs...

    ReplyDelete
  105. rufus said...
    So, Israel with a GDP per Capita of $28,000.00 can afford healthcare for all, but the US with a GDP/capita of $46,000.00 Can't?


    Yep rufus, it's all those acorn workers and illegals in the states...

    ReplyDelete
  106. Israel seems to be doing just fine without attempts to correct one man residing in Arizona who by any indication takes idle pleasure in rattling what cages he can.

    ReplyDelete
  107. "...I'd rather see a Moses Day than a MLK day..."

    I don't know.

    (From one of Allen's posts recently:)

    "In the 1st story Moses sees an Egyptian beating a Jew to death and he kills him before the Egyptian could murder his innocent victim."

    Sounds like Moses had some anger management issues to me.

    Hell, in Pale Rider all Clint Eastwood did was slap the bad guys around with an axe handle a little when they roughed up the miner.


    .

    ReplyDelete
  108. Allen: It happens again and again, without a word of complaint by those who are terribly offended when XXXX take the field in defense.

    The 2006 Israeli-Lebanon War was a fiasco precisely because the XXXX themselves were concerned about offending people when they took to the field in defense. If the XXXX were serious about defending themselves, every bottle rocket from Gaza would be answered with the highest value target in Gaza being wiped off the list.

    ReplyDelete
  109. Rufus,

    Israel is a land of milk and honey..

    Free stitches for everyone!

    If you get your head blow apart by some wretched excuse of a human being, they will patch you up, for free!

    such a deal....

    Rufus, when America gets to the point of war that Israel has endured for the last 60 years, I am sure getting a blown off leg will be covered in America also...

    ReplyDelete
  110. The first reference I see to the ADL was Allen @ 08:46

    ReplyDelete
  111. Stated: The 2006 Israeli-Lebanon War was a fiasco precisely because the XXXX themselves were concerned about offending people when they took to the field in defense. If the XXXX were serious about defending themselves, every bottle rocket from Gaza would be answered with the highest value target in Gaza being wiped off the list.


    I dont think it was a fiasco... Israel could not do what the rest of the world does... It's not permitted...

    Condi would have split her shorts if Israel had simply just wiped southern lebanon off the map (or gaza)

    In the end, Hezbollah got it's ears boxed...

    Regardless of it strength today...

    Israel did not lose in 2006 or last January in Gaza...

    ReplyDelete
  112. rufus said...
    The first reference I see to the ADL was Allen @ 08:46


    that's cause you dont have SPECIAL, MADE in ISREALLY COOL, see last thread glasses...

    Your made in America glasses suck..

    ReplyDelete
  113. The fact is: Israel has a GDP per Capita of $28,000.00. If you are a poor, unemployed Jew (and, I presume, Palestinian) in Israel, and have a heart attack, or stroke you will receive "World-Class" Medical Treatment.

    The Israelis can "Afford" first class care, for all, on a GDP/capita of $28,000.


    Now, you're telling me that the United States, with a GDP/Capita of $46,000.00, CAN'T Afford health care for everyone.

    I ain't buying it.

    ReplyDelete
  114. rufus,

    Re: health care, lust and covetousness

    Lust

    NOUN:

    2.a. An overwhelming desire or craving: a lust for power.



    Covetousness

    NOUN:

    1. An excessive and culpable desire for the possessions of another. See Synonyms at “jealousy”.



    …hmmm…decisions…decisions…

    ReplyDelete
  115. To the few remaining conservatives here in Massachusetts, it's pretty exciting to look forward to maybe voting for a winner for a change. The lead is not great, but it's growing with each new poll and that smells like momentum. Coakely has to be the worst candidate for a tight race in a long time. Last week she was quoted by the Globe as having replied, "what do you expect me to do, stand out in the cold at Fenway Park and shake hands?" to a question about her dedication to campaigning. I've heard that Brown will be out in the cold in front of Boston Garden shaking hands at the Bruins game today. From personal observation, yard signs seem to favor Brown 2 or 3 to 1. I've had 2 relatives email me from California telling me I should donate money to Brown like they did. I'm trying to contain my irrational exuberance, but it's hard. The bottom line in any Massachusetts election is how many dead people, busses full of SEIU thugs, Acorns, etc. are marshaled to the polls by the pinky-ring string pullers.

    A miracle could happen though.

    ReplyDelete
  116. "In the 1st story Moses sees an Egyptian beating a Jew to death and he kills him before the Egyptian could murder his innocent victim."

    Sounds like Moses had some anger management issues to me.


    Sounds like Moses stood up for the slave and underdog to me. According to the story it was a defining moment for Moses, right there. He could have walked away, not caring.

    The issue wasn't over seating arrangements at a lunch counter in the American south, or who sits where on a bus.

    ReplyDelete
  117. Then here comes Obama trying to sell her as some kind of outsider willing to take on the man.

    It's like he doesn't get it. He is "the man" now.


    Hee hee!

    ReplyDelete
  118. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  119. That's just silly, Allen.

    With more customers Doctors will make MORE Money, not less.

    Simple "Supply, and Demand."

    ReplyDelete
  120. rufus said...
    The fact is: Israel has a GDP per Capita of $28,000.00. If you are a poor, unemployed Jew (and, I presume, Palestinian) in Israel, and have a heart attack, or stroke you will receive "World-Class" Medical Treatment.


    That would be "poor arab-israeli" and you would have to take medical care from (yuck, stinky Jews)


    Rufus: The Israelis can "Afford" first class care, for all, on a GDP/capita of $28,000.


    Now, you're telling me that the United States, with a GDP/Capita of $46,000.00, CAN'T Afford health care for everyone.


    In Israel, they dont have a the WASTE that America has, they have chosen to allow their leaders to keep their bribes in the 10's of thousands rather than as in American our bribes are in the millions..

    Maybe America should not be 112 nations, nor Haiti, nor protecting the sea lanes for Arabia..

    Maybe America has different priorities, like 6 BILLION for ACORN...

    You GNP comparison is really....




    STUPID...
    I ain't buying it.

    ReplyDelete
  121. Or, let me put it differently. I send money, via my taxes, to Israel so they can Give Health Care to EVERYONE.

    However, I shouldn't pay taxes for AMERICANS to have Health Care.

    That doesn't add up. (at least in "Rednek Math.")

    ReplyDelete
  122. trish,

    Your concern is noted.

    DR does not get "under my saddle".

    DR isn't really the target. DR serves as the foil used to target those who hypocritically spew indignation when his prejudices are confronted by Jews.

    ReplyDelete
  123. Since the banks are closed and no mail delivery, I'm thinking about driving back down to the Grand Ronde this afternoon.

    Let's all hope for a Brown win tomorrow, we can all agree on that I think.

    And, I believe he will win.

    ReplyDelete
  124. $46,000.00/$28,000.00 = 1.64

    We have One Hundred and Sixty-Four Percent Higher GDP/Capita than Israel, but we can't afford as good a quality of healthcare as Israel.

    Or, "We Don't Deserve It?"

    ReplyDelete
  125. rufus said...

    "With more customers Doctors will make MORE Money, not less."


    Rufus, doctors do not lack in patients; they lack time; unless you supporters of the proposed law have found more than 24 hours in the day and a human spieces able to withstand the stress.

    Human beings are not factors of production or widgets. And doctors are not yet robotic and self-perpetuating.

    What is truly silly is the ancient, yet fundamentally flawed belief that we can have something for nothing by soaking our "betters".

    ReplyDelete
  126. Then why do the smartest people in the world, the Israelis, have Universal Coverage?

    ReplyDelete
  127. trish said...

    You know that can backfire.

    Mon Jan 18, 03:15:00 PM EST


    For comfort I look to bob's poke in the eye:

    "Sounds like Moses stood up for the slave and underdog to me. According to the story it was a defining moment for Moses, right there. He could have walked away, not caring.

    The issue wasn't over seating arrangements at a lunch counter in the American south, or who sits where on a bus."

    Mon Jan 18, 03:06:00 PM EST

    ReplyDelete
  128. Could it be that you think All Jews should have health coverage, but are unconcerned about All Americans?

    Could that argument be just a "touch" racist?

    ReplyDelete
  129. : )

    When otherwise temperate individuals of well-meaning grow as frustrated with and tired of one's passionate defenses as with another's eager assaults - more inclined to throw up their hands and want to hear no more of it, for the time being at least - indirection would seem to recommend itself.

    ReplyDelete
  130. rufus said...

    Then why do the smartest people in the world, the Israelis, have Universal Coverage?

    Mon Jan 18, 03:23:00 PM EST


    ...because the founders were mostly socialists...Not everyone then or now (Netanyahu) happens to agree with socialized stuff. Socialism inevitably leads to tyranny because people filled with covetousness impatiently kill the golden goose to extract another golden egg.

    The founders of XXXXXXX would have appreciated your enthusiasim for communal life.

    ReplyDelete
  131. How do you know the Egyptian was beating the Jew "To Death?" He wasn't "Dead."

    How do you know the Jew didn't have a good ass-whupping, coming? Maybe he boinged the man's wife, or killed one of his children, or stole something from him.

    I'd be more impressed if he'd merely broken the fight up (as he did between his tribe-members) and ascertained the reason for the altercation. I'm sure there was some sort of "Justice," other than murder, available (even if it did, eventually, lead to a sentence of death.

    Vigilantism doesn't strike me as a, particularly, good foundation for a World Religion.

    ReplyDelete
  132. Providing "Healing" to all members of the Tribe is Not "soaking the betters." It's simply "common sense."

    Even the most Primitive tribes minister to the needs of the least able. If they didn't their "tribes" would, surely, cease to exist.


    And, btw, I don't feel the least bit "passionate" about health care. I have, from time to time, been "passionate" about wives, girlfriends, children, my job - but never about "colonoscopies for the disadvantaged."

    I do, however, believe it will be good for the "soul" of the country to help the "sick" get well.

    ReplyDelete
  133. trish said...

    : )

    When otherwise temperate individuals of well-meaning grow as frustrated with and tired of one's passionate defenses as with another's eager assaults - more inclined to throw up their hands and want to hear no more of it, for the time being at least - indirection would seem to recommend itself.

    Mon Jan 18, 03:30:00 PM EST



    Point well made, Ma'am :)

    But it has not been a waste. We now know a great deal more about the motives of the players, eg health care "reform".

    ReplyDelete
  134. rufus,

    I have addressed the working conditions of health care providers and the challenges they face in an already cumbersome system. You have addressed their housing stock. That just about says all that needs to be said.

    ReplyDelete
  135. CARACAS -- President Hugo Chavez ordered Sunday the seizure of a French-owned retail chain on accusations that it raised prices after Venezuela devalued the currency by half.

    Anybody else wanna do business there? Knock yourself out.

    ReplyDelete
  136. So, the country with the highest IQ per capita in the world went with Universal Health Insurance, and has continued with it.

    All the country with the Highest IQ/Capita in the world would have to do if they thought it was, in retrospect, a bad idea would be to "vote it out;"

    but they haven't.

    Well, it strikes me that if the smartest human beings on earth (and, Israel Does have the Highest IQ/capita of any country on the planet) think having healthcare for everyone is a good idea, I guess a poor, dum rednek from Mississip might ought to pay it a little attention.

    Don't you think?

    ReplyDelete
  137. allen, why should some Americans get health care and others not? Why should some American children receive first rate medical care and other American children receive substandard care or none at all? In your view of American society should health care be provided only to those who can pay?

    ReplyDelete
  138. Allen: We now know a great deal more about the motives of the players, eg health care "reform".

    We also have a new Donkey section of the Elephant Bar, apparently. Most of us don't cotton to socialized medicine.

    ReplyDelete
  139. Out of the shower...



    How do you know the Jew didn't have a good ass-whupping, coming? Maybe he boinged the man's wife, or killed one of his children, or stole something from him.


    O Lordy, Rufus.

    That's not a creative reading of the text.

    A choice is made for the oppressed. Somebody stood up for the slave.

    ReplyDelete
  140. You have addressed their housing stock. That just about says all that needs to be said.

    You seemed worried that we would lose doctors through impoverishment if we passed HC reform. You gave the example of some doctors not treating medicare patients. I merely pointed out that different doctors have, at different times, bitched about medicare reimbursement since there was a medicare, and, using a housing proxy, pointed out that they have continued to prosper.

    I think what's really happening is the "Israel" argument has caught you flat-footed, and you're not sure where to go next.

    ReplyDelete
  141. All Israelis are created equal rufus but not all Americans.

    ReplyDelete
  142. I'm not trying to be "creative," Bob. I'm just reading what you all wrote. One man was kicking another's ass, so he "Murdered" him.

    Sounds a little extreme, at least until one knows the details.

    I've told you before; I think all religion is trash. Stories cooked up to control the dummies, and take their money.

    ReplyDelete
  143. All Israelis are created equal rufus but not all Americans

    Maybe they just belong to a "Better" Tribe, Ash.

    ReplyDelete
  144. Blogger rufus said...

    I guess we want to roll back Medicare then, eh Doug
    ?

    That would be a good place to start. Just leave me alone with the plan I had before being conscripted into Medicare on my 65th birthday. Now I'm having to carry the plan plus Medicare. Plan premiums didn't go down, but I get less coverage plus pay the Medicare premium on top.

    Meantime you sit back, justifiably pleased with your VA care, and tell the rest of us we should rejoice at our opportunities to sacrifice. There's two big differences between you and me. You've got VA by virtue of the fact you enrolled before a politically determined arbitrary deadline for joining the program whereas I waited, carrying private insurance, until I retired. The second difference is I'd never have the gall to beat the drums for a socialized medicine program that I was exempted from.

    .

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  145. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  146. Sounds messed up Linear. All Americans should have the same plan - even Congresscritters!

    ReplyDelete
  147. rufus said...
    Could it be that you think All Jews should have health coverage, but are unconcerned about All Americans?

    Could that argument be just a "touch" racist?


    No, What Israel does with it's citizens is not my concern...

    As for America? I dont think ALL Jews should have coverage at the expense of ALL AMERICANS.

    But I do think ALL people in America should have basic care and trauma coverage. But if you want "extras" pay for it...

    ReplyDelete
  148. rufus,

    As your friend Quirk would say, "You are using a red herring."

    The health care system of Israel has no more to do with that of the US than that of Mars. You are trying to compare a flea to a Great Blue Whale.

    If Israel has come to rely upon your tax dollars for the running of its health care system, that should be a warning to you. What will you do when the Chinese and EU refrain from paying your growing indebtedness? I would think a prudent man, such as you, would avoid such penury like the plague.

    You must have me confused with another. I have no use for socialized anything, other than what is set forth in the Constitution. If you wish to model your life upon the economic communalism of a persecuted band of idealists, knock yourself out. Do note: socialism is withering in Israel. And if Netanyahu has his way, its demise will be accelerated.

    Your sudden fondness for all things Israeli is touching, though. Let's hope it lasts throughout the day.

    ReplyDelete
  149. "According to the story it was a defining moment for Moses, right there. He could have walked away, not caring."

    Or he could have just roughed the guy up with an axe handle.

    Time to grow up Bob. It was a joke.

    You can write into the story anything you want. (Just as Allen added in the "before the Egyptian could murder his innocent victim.")

    As far as I understand it, Moses was condemned for this act by the Hebrews as well as by the Pharoah.

    Of course the Torah wasn't written for guys like you or me so who knows.


    .

    ReplyDelete
  150. Ash,

    My view of the poor is much like that found in Swift's Modest Proposal. Then again, I could compare to W. C. Fields: "I love children when they're well done."

    Feel free to take a tinkle break at this juncture.

    ReplyDelete
  151. News at a Glance*

    Jeffrey K. Norman, CEO of St. Joseph Medical Center said as many as 369 heart patients may have had coronary stints implanted unnecessarily.

    Meet your new care givers folks.

    Jeffrey K. Norman, B.S. in Political Science and M.A. in Public Health. Norman is credited with improving labor productivity, reducing supply chain costs and greater management accountability at his last job in Scottsdale.

    What's missing from his C.V.?

    *Arkansas Democrat-Gazette, 1-18-10

    ReplyDelete
  152. "But it has not been a waste."

    Certainly not - because I've had three beers.

    And because the remainder of the day at the Bar might prove interesting.

    ReplyDelete
  153. Well, allen, I guess the modern equivalent would be to suggest the poor offer their children up for medical experimentation.

    ReplyDelete
  154. Quirk said...

    "(Just as Allen added in the "before the Egyptian could murder his innocent victim.")"


    As the matter of fact and proof reading would show, Allen added nothing. Instead, Allen quoted his rabbi, who came by this interpretation from a long line of rabbis going back more than 2,000 years. (Hebrews/Jews/Israelis have been literate for at least 3,000 years, as we all learned yesterday.)

    We might assume that they were not all buffoons intent on making a murderer (Moses) look good. Might we not anticipate (childishly to be sure) that the Egyptian might have said something such as, "I am going to kill you, Kike!" Also, possibly the Egyptian was using an instrument, say a small sword or spear, which by its very nature was inflicting potentially fatal wounds to the person of the helpless Hebrew slave. Let's try to think like adults instead of young sophomores trying to score foolish points of debate.

    ReplyDelete
  155. "Hello"

    "Yes?"

    "Another job for you"

    "Who this time?"

    "Rufus"

    So off she flew to the home of the Rufii.

    Knock knock.

    "Hello"

    "Rufus, you need a friend."

    "Come in, come in, may I offer you a drink?"

    "Surely. What have you?"

    "Monshine, scotch or wine"

    "I'll have a little of the shine. And you have one for you, and one for me too Rufus"

    So they sit on the coach and drink, the lady takes a sip, nearly gags, as Rufus downs his two.

    "Another?"

    "You have another, and one for me too. I'll just keep sipping this."

    As Rufus goes to pour, she pours most of hers on the floor.

    Rufus sits a little close, she moves away. And Rufus downs two more.

    "Rufus dear, this goes to my head, have you anything a little weaker? A little wine?"

    "Sure honey, what kind?"

    "What have you?"

    "Strawberry or dandelion wine."

    "A little of the lion, please."

    God she thinks, his breath is awful. I don't know if I can this.

    "Here dear."

    "Thank you sweet, you have two more."

    "You know, I think I will."

    And he does.

    God, she thinks, his farts do stink. But I must do this.

    After six or eight more, Rufus nods to sleep, and snores.

    Now's the chance, fast from her purse she takes, a rubber hose, and shoves it up his ass.

    Rufus stirs a bit, then falls fast asleep.

    Quick, she hooks the other end to his four burner Coleman camping stove, and turns up the gas, full blast.

    Out the door she flees, shutting it fast, steals his flex fuel car, and down the darkened street she goes.

    Slowly gassed to death is our brave thane, gassed on his own methane.


    Some weeks later the autopsy report is published, short and to the point.

    "The cause of death is certain, but just how it happened we don't know. Two theories presented themselves to our deliberations. Suicide is not to be ruled out, though it's so odd, this is in some doubt. If so, what a way to go. Or, it might be an odd energy experiment gone wrong. We know Rufus was working to solve the nation's energy problems, and thought much of natural gas, but this seems just bizarre. We just don't know what happened."


    Ruf don't be angry its just a joke. I've taken some heavy hits lately myself.

    ReplyDelete
  156. Ash said...
    Well, allen, I guess the modern equivalent would be to suggest the poor offer their children up for medical experimentation.

    Mon Jan 18, 04:41:00 PM EST



    Ash, you are beginning to grow on me.

    ReplyDelete
  157. Allen, I have No fondness for Israel. I have no Antipathy toward Israel. To me, they are just a bunch of folks that are "not us." Just like the French, the Swedes, and Taiwanese.

    I have no "severe dislike" for Jews. No more than for Buddhists, Pentacostals, or Rostafanarians. Just another tribe. My tribe is the "Ruffians." We have our hands full taking care of our own. No need to "borrow trouble."

    I am in favor of helping the poor, and the sick get health care. Perhaps, it's because, having been in the business, I'm a little less susceptible to the hyperventilations of the Republicans as to the cost.

    I realize there will be a cost, but I also know that if you're in a tax bracket that causes it to bite you'll be doing fine, anyway.

    I'm probably a little more aware of the "hidden costs" that you're paying now. All those "free" trips those people are making to the Emergency Rooms aren't "Free." You be payin, Bubba; it's just in the fine print that you're not reading.

    You can't convince me that France, Switzerland, Israel, and Chile can provide top-notch healthcare for all their citizens, and we can't.

    Gotta go. Have fun.

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  158. I read Israel has more doctors per capita than we, but a big part of this was from Russian physicians moving to Israel. They seem to have four medical schools, and the Russian influx of doctors is retiring, and they are working on plans as to how to come up with replacements. They graduate 300 doctors a year, and this isn't enough. Being the creative people they are, I think they will come up with an intelligent solution.

    All countries are different. Cuba has more doctors than anywhere in the world, but of course they really aren't doctors, just called that.

    I want choice. I don't want the Ash's of the world telling me, or anyone else, what they can and cannot buy. And that's what this health care bill does, in the long run.

    The hell with it. Start over and get it right, or at least reasonable.

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  159. Bobal, are you one of those tea baggers that walk about with a sign saying "Keep Government out of my Medicare"?

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  160. Democratic Mayor In Massachusetts Endorses Brown

    This is the most amazing situation. Who would have dreamed two years ago we'd be here?

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  161. I've paid my own way Ash. And will do so. As to Medicare, I'm not there yet. And don't know that much about it. Most, or lots, of doctors don't seem to want to take it. It did nothing for my mother, father or aunt, I can tell you that.

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  162. A new InsiderAdvantage poll conducted exclusively for POLITICO shows Republican Scott Brown surging to a nine-point advantage over Martha Coakley a day before Massachusetts voters trek to the ballot box to choose a new senator.


    According to the survey conducted Sunday evening, Brown leads the Democratic attorney general 52 percent to 43 percent.


    "I actually think the bottom is falling out," said InsiderAdvantage CEO Matt Towery, referring to Coakley's fall in the polls over the last ten days. "I think that this candidate is in freefall. Clearly this race is imploding for her."


    The numbers show males and independents overwhelmingly breaking for Brown, who has married his GQ looks with a populist tone in a pick-up truck on the campaign trail.


    Brown holds a 15-point lead among males and crushes Coakley by 41 points among self-described independents, a group that's been steadily inching away from the Democratic party over the last year due to growing apprehension with government spending, bailouts and health care reform.


    "Men are not going to vote for Coakley at all. You have a very angry male voter who's repudiating whatever is being said in Washington and they're taking it out on this woman. And independents are clearly going to the Republican in droves. What's left are the Democratic voters," said Towery, who is a former aide to Newt Gingrich.



    Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0110/31621.html#ixzz0d0OYmNh5

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  163. You know, the amazing thing is, Bob. My mother had medicare, and my father didn't.

    They Both Died.

    Go figure.

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  164. And, while we're on the subject of other countries:

    What kind of results do you suppose Canada would get if they were allowed to spend Twice as much on Healthcare, or, about the same as we spend.

    They, Already, cover ALL of Their citizens, whereas we leave a population the size of Norther neighbor "swangin in the wind."

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  165. I find it astounding that so many believe that Congressman deserve better health care than other Americans, or the rich should get better health care, or, even that you should think some Americans simply don't deserve any health care.

    ReplyDelete
  166. "...his rabbi, who came by this interpretation from a long line of rabbis going back more than 2,000 years. (Hebrews/Jews/Israelis have been literate for at least 3,000 years, as we all learned yesterday.)"

    Sounds like a kinda self-serving interpretation to me Allen. But that's just me. Must be part of that oral tradition Wio was talking about. But, hey it's your religion. Whatever.

    But, then ...

    "We might assume ...

    Might we not anticipate...

    Also, possibly..."



    :)

    Allen, do you even read this stuff before you post it?

    Just as easily,

    Mightn't we also "assume" that since the slave was considered property by the Egyptian that it would be going against his own self-interest to kill him?

    Or while not PC, "mightn't we anticipate" that Moses had just finished off a few brewski's over at the palace and (like in that old joke about god and Job) there was something about the Egyptian that "just pissed Moses right off"

    "Also, possibly" Moses was the BC James Bond. Bumps off the Egyptian. Leans up against a rock and slowly lights a cigarette and then quips, "Well, looks like someone bit off more than he could Jew."

    Assume? Possibly? Mightn't we anticipate?

    Stick with Bob, Allen. He'll buy into your silliness.

    .

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  167. I find it astounding that so many believe that Congressman deserve better health care than other Americans

    I've never met anyone that believes that--have you? Name one, I'd like to meet him/her.


    or the rich should get better health care

    A more difficult proposition. If someone wants to spend their money on some procedure or other, rather than a new pickup truck, what's the problem with that?


    even that you should think some Americans simply don't deserve any health care.

    The basics should be there for all.

    There will come a time with this monster when the government will simply say, this American simply doesn't deserve any (more) health care.

    Time for grandma to get out of the way.

    It's the choices, Ash, and having the government decide who gets what and when and whether it is 'worth it' or not.

    Figure out some plan to retain choices, and cover everybody on the basics, I'd probably be with you.

    You were the one talking about rationing some months ago.

    Rationing is a bad word in my brain, when it comes to health care.

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  168. Obviously, allen, you do not understand the liberal use of "code words" in their writings.

    But "white supremest" is "code" for Nazis and KKK.

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  169. Health care is "rationed" all the time.

    Right now, 30 Million Americans are "Rationed" right out of Dodge.

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  170. What do you think Ash? Should Moses have killed the overseer? Or let the abuse of the slave continue? Forever? It doesn't seem to be a story about one incident, but a whole situation.

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  171. So there I was at a little shop just off of Duval and the day manager makes me guess where she's from.

    And then we get into a one-way discussion of who has it harder. You gritted your teeth but she was terribly homesick - and prickly as hell, without prompting, about THAT WAR.

    The Israeli police attache in Bogota: Paranoid as an in-patient.

    Israelis are the way they are. Didn't spring up in vacuum.

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  172. And they still do really, really good work.

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  173. Quirk,

    You aren't worth the ink.

    I will overlook your error of attribution...no need to trouble yourself by begging pardon...Possibly you are dyslexic, or at least one might anticipate as much.


    :)

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  174. desert rat said...

    Obviously, allen, you do not understand the liberal use of "code words" in their writings.

    But "white supremest" is "code" for Nazis and KKK.


    You couldn't find a quote, could you?

    ReplyDelete
  175. The quotes for the white supremacists remarks are posted above.

    I need not dig deeper.
    The "birthers" are a danger to the Republic, the Tea Parties recruiting grounds for white supremacists.
    According to the opening pages of the ADLoBB website.

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  176. From the anti-government "Tea Parties," where protestors have made explicit Nazi comparisons or suggested that the president is subverting the Constitution, to anger-filled town hall meeting disruptions over health care, the wave of anti-government animus has manifested itself in many forms, according to ADL.

    http://www.adl.org/PresRele/Extremism_72/5655_72.htm

    ReplyDelete
  177. An ADLoBB press release makes the comparison, it was so easy to find that I just could not resist.

    ReplyDelete
  178. allen, the life long Federal Socialist that portrays himself as a "conservative" digs in to defend the liberal establishment of the ADLoBB.

    The truth prevails, again.

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  179. "I will overlook your error of attribution...no need to trouble yourself by begging pardon..."

    Do you really think that anyone at the EB really cares whether the quote came from you or one of the rabbis you quoted and seem to agree with?

    "You aren't worth the ink."

    Oh, you must have gone back and actually read that drivel you posted, right?

    :)

    .

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  180. I hope this bottle of chardonnay wasn't, like, a special bottle.

    They don't label them for house guests.

    ReplyDelete
  181. A special Welcome Home gift suggestion, if I may?

    A mixed case of 2BuckChuck. Always a good year!

    My preference being the impertinent Merlot.

    .

    ReplyDelete
  182. I think the closest one is something like an hour away.

    I'll wait until we go back down.

    There's one on Main St. in Fairfax.

    ReplyDelete
  183. rufus,

    Re: Israeli health care system

    Rufus, I did not broach the question of Israel's health care delivery system. Frankly, it is irrelevant to the discussion; albeit, it does provide ample opportunity for barely disguised bashing.

    My arguments address the current state of health care and the additional burden you would thoughtlessly place upon it. While the Emperor can name his horse a senator, a horse is a horse, of course, of course. Well, a government bureaucrat is not a physician anymore than a horse is a senator. And unlike horses, doctors can't begin to race at three years of age.

    I wrote "thoughtlessly" because, while you assure us that all will be well, you have not provided a persuasive argument other than anecdotally pointing to other countries about which you know next to nothing and, of course, "the poor".

    Have you any idea at all about how many of "the poor" need to be permanently institutionalized, under humane custodial care? One of "the poor", just yesterday near Atlanta, jumped to his death from a bridge onto the interstate. I see them everyday, sometimes outside the VA medical center (smoking) carrying their little bags of medication, to be sold or bartered when they get back home, under the overpass.

    Addressing further "the poor", you do know that millions of these are children, the progeny of totally dysfunctional couplings? Will you advocate the sterilization of "undesirable" adults? Certainly, that would reduce substantially "the poor" of the future, don't you agree?

    For me this is not an issue of cost, per se. Instead, my concern is the further degradation of the system by intrusive bureaucrats. Indeed, on principle alone, I oppose the further socialization of America.

    For goodness sake, aren't you even a little bit concerned about the explosive growth of government involvement in your life? Recall: It was the Federal government, in its infinite wisdom, which has brought this country to its current sorry state. And you would have me believe that it will do better with universal health care. One wonders when you will advocate collectivization of agriculture. I ANTICIPATE such a call following the next cycle of droughts, such as those of the 30’s and 50’s.

    Israel has had both collective agriculture and medicine. Slowly, it is weaning itself from the mystique of "one for all and all for one".

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  184. DR,

    The PROTESTORS are making the comparison...Duh...

    ReplyDelete
  185. One wonders when you will advocate collectivization of agriculture.

    The call will be for 'land reform'.

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  186. Quirk,

    Re: misattribution

    :)>>>

    (That's a raspberry, I think.)

    ReplyDelete
  187. Using the words in the same sentence, allen, pure propaganda technique.

    Which is what the ADLoBB peddles.

    ReplyDelete