COLLECTIVE MADNESS


“Soft despotism is a term coined by Alexis de Tocqueville describing the state into which a country overrun by "a network of small complicated rules" might degrade. Soft despotism is different from despotism (also called 'hard despotism') in the sense that it is not obvious to the people."

Friday, April 04, 2008

Obama's 2007 Judgment and Statement on Nato Missile Defense Wrong.

I can hardly wait to hear from Obama advisor"Know it all" General Tony McPeak.

The Bush Administration has been developing plans to deploy interceptors and radar systems in Poland and the Czech Republic as part of a missile defense system designed to protect against the potential threat of Iranian nuclear armed missiles. If we can responsibly deploy missile defenses that would protect us and our allies we should – but only when the system works. We need to make sure any missile defense system would be effective before deployment. The Bush Administration has in the past exaggerated missile defense capabilities and rushed deployments for political purposes. The Bush Administration has also done a poor job of consulting its NATO allies about the deployment of a missile defense system that has major implications for all of them. We must not allow this issue to divide “new Europe” and “old Europe,” as the Bush Administration tried to do over Iraq.

-Barack Obama 16 July 2007

This is a huge win for George Bush and John McCain and Donald Rumsfeld. It is a huge win for national security.

Today NATO leaders endorsed a controversial US missile shield for Europe yesterday, and US and Czech officials agreed on deployment of the first element – an advanced radar, despite strong Russian opposition. Had Barack Obama been President, this never would have happened.

US officials have confirmed a final communique on the missile defence system, parts of which will be stationed in Poland and the Czech Republic, and said the deal would "recognise the substantive contribution to the protection of the allies".
_____________________________

In case it sounds easy let's see what was said in the NY Times on February 4, 2001:

U.S. Tries Defusing Allies' Opposition to Missile Defense


By MICHAEL R. GORDON New York Times

MUNICH, Feb. 3 — Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld, the first senior Bush administration official to visit Europe, tried today to defuse opposition to the administration's antimissile plans by offering to help European nations and other allies to deploy missile defenses.

But while Mr. Rumsfeld assured European allies that the United States would consult with them on its antimissile plan, he did not address in any detail one of the Europeans' principal concerns: how an antimissile defense can be reconciled with strategic arms control and a productive relationship with Moscow.

"The United States intends to develop and deploy a missile defense designed to defend our people and forces against a limited ballistic missile attack, and is prepared to assist friends and allies threatened by missile attack to deploy such defenses," Mr. Rumsfeld said in a speech to a conference of top political officials and defense specialists.

Mr. Rumsfeld underscored that the Bush administration was determined to proceed with an antimissile defense of United States territory even if it could not overcome the objections from the Russians, the Chinese and the Europeans. He described a missile defense as nothing less than a moral imperative.

Missile defense was hardly the only sensitive issue today. The European Union's move to develop a 60,000-member rapid reaction force by 2003 has drawn a wary reaction from the Bush administration.

While not opposing the initiative, Mr. Rumsfeld was clearly skeptical, and stressed the need for great care to ensure that the European Union does not detract from NATO.

Mr. Bush's fatigue with the Balkan peacekeeping mission also remains a continuing source of anxiety in Europe. Mr. Rumsfeld said little on the subject today, saying that the matter was under review at the White House. The United States and Europe also have to decide how to proceed with NATO expansion, a topic that greatly worries the Russians.

But as European leaders have challenged the missile defense plan in recent weeks, the issue has risen to the fore. The main European concern is that deployment of an antimissile shield will undermine the framework of nuclear arms control and spoil relations with the Russians. Or as President Jacques Chirac of France put it last month, an American missile defense "cannot fail to relaunch the arms race in the world."

Mr. Chirac has not been the only critic. Rudolf Scharping, the German defense minister, has questioned the technological feasibility of the missile defense plan, and on a recent visit to Moscow urged that arms control agreements be preserved.

The Russians have sought to stoke the Europeans' fears, warning that they may abandon the strategic arms constraints they have negotiated with Washington if the Bush administration abandons the 1972 Antiballistic Missile Treaty and deploys an antimissile system.

The head of the Russian Security Council, Sergei Ivanov, is due to address the conference on Sunday, raising the specter of an American-Russian tussle for European opinion.

In his attempts to sway European opinion, Mr. Rumsfeld presented several arguments. He suggested that antimissile defenses could be reconciled with some arms control treaties, avoiding the bluntness of comments he made in Congressional hearings — and even on the plane flying to the conference — that the ABM treaty was an anachronism.

Mr. Rumsfeld also sought to turn long-standing European concerns about American isolationism or military intervention into arguments for missile defenses.

Without a missile shield, he suggested, future American leaders might turn isolationist in a crisis and shrink from confronting a missile- wielding third world aggressor. Alternatively, he warned, America might have to carry out a pre-emptive strike against a rogue nation.

"A system of defense need not be perfect, but the American people must not be left completely defenseless," Mr. Rumsfeld said. "It is not so much a technical question as a matter of a president's constitutional responsibility. Indeed, it is, in many respects, a moral issue."

Mr. Rumsfeld's case was helped by Senator Joseph I. Lieberman, who told the meeting that there was a general consensus in Washington that some sort of missile defense should be deployed. "The question from an American point of view is not whether we will have a national missile defense but when and how," Senator Lieberman said. "This is not a technologically feasible program now. We are some years away."

Senator John McCain and former Secretary of State Henry A. Kissinger also called for missile defenses, adding to the sense of inevitability.

The European response to Mr. Rumsfeld's proposal today was respectful, if restrained. Joschka Fischer, the German foreign minister, appeared to speak for most of his fellow European foreign ministers when he said that European nations were glad that Washington wanted to consult with them on the antimissile plan but that a missile defense must not come at the expense of arms control. That is a difficult balancing act that neither the Americans nor the Europeans were prepared to discuss in detail.

In general, neither European nor American officials seemed inclined to quarrel openly today about missile defense or the European Union's rapid reaction initiative.

"The United States has made it clear it intends to develop a missile defense system," said George Robertson, the NATO secretary general. "We have to take the sincerity and commitment of the United States seriously."

European officials cling to the hope that an American missile defense might be compatible with a modified version of the ABM treaty. Mr. Rumsfeld was careful not to exclude that option, but it may well be put to the test once the scale of the administration's plans are known.

Former President Bill Clinton proposed limited defense, involving 100 interceptors and a battle management radar in Alaska, which he planned to reconcile with an amended ABM treaty. There is no reason to think, however, that the Bush administration will settle for such a limited system, which was still too much for the Russians.

Mr. Rumsfeld, a former American ambassador to NATO, has only been in office for two weeks, and the Bush administration as a whole has not yet had time to develop comprehensive missile defense proposals.

Still, Mr. Rumsfeld's offer to help the Europeans and other allies deploy defenses raised a number of tricky questions, such as which land- based, sea-based or space-based systems might be used. As a result, it is impossible to say how long it would take to develop a system, what it would cost or to what extent it would require modification of the ABM treaty.

Mr. Rumsfeld did not say how much the Europeans would have to pay for antimissile defenses of their territory — no small concern for a continent whose military spending has lagged — and what Washington might contribute.

Mr. Rumsfeld has been something of a hard-liner on arms control. While Bush administration officials have previously talked of making deep, even unilateral cuts in the American nuclear arsenal, he had no specific arms control proposals to offer Moscow today. Yet he insisted that the Russians were mistaken to perceive an antimissile defenses as quest for strategic advantage.

He said a limited American defense could not neutralize the Russian nuclear arsenal, and he suggested that the Russians understood that but were pretending not to understand to build opposition to the American plan in Europe.

"The idea of an arms race between the United States and Russia ought not to be front and center in our thinking," Mr. Rumsfeld said. "It is something that is a leftover, a relic in our thinking."


45 comments:

  1. He'll say he didn't say it.

    The Audacity of Hypocrisy

    Obama Lies - Quick Glance
    OBAMA LAUNDRY LIST OF LIES as of April 03, 2008 (68 lies and counting)

    1.) Selma Got Me Born - LIAR, your parents felt safe enough to have you in 1961 - Selma had no effect on your birth, as Selma was in 1965.

    2.) Father Was A Goat Herder - LIAR, he was a privileged, well educated youth, who went on to work with the Kenyan Government.

    3.) Father Was A Proud Freedom Fighter - LIAR, he was part of one of the most corrupt and violent governments Kenya has ever had

    4.) My Family Has Strong Ties To African Freedom - LIAR, your cousin Raila Odinga has created mass violence in attempting to overturn a legitimate election in 2007, in Kenya. It is the first widespread violence in decades.

    5.) My Grandmother Has Always Been A Christian - LIAR, she does her daily Salat prayers at 5am according to her own interviews. Not to mention, Christianity wouldn’t allow her to have been one of 14 wives to 1 man.

    6.) My Name is African Swahili - LIAR, your name is Arabic and ‘Baraka’ (from which Barack came) means ‘blessed’ in that language. Hussein is also Arabic and so is Obama.

    7.) I Never Practiced Islam - LIAR, you practiced it daily at school, where you were registered as a Muslim and kept that faith for 31 years,until your wife made you change, so you could run for office.

    8.) My School In Indonesia Was Christian - LIAR, you were registered as Muslim there and got in trouble in Koranic Studies for making faces (check your own book).

    9.) I Was Fluent In Indonesian - LIAR, not one teacher says you could speak the language.

    10.) Because I Lived In Indonesia, I Have More Foreign Experience - LIAR, you were there from the ages of 6 to 10, and couldn’t even speak the language. What did you learn, how to study the Koran and watch cartoons.

    11.) I Am Stronger On Foreign Affairs - LIAR, except for Africa (surprise) and the Middle East (bigger surprise), you have never been anywhere else on the planet and thus have NO experience with our closest allies.

    12.) I Blame My Early Drug Use On Ethnic Confusion - LIAR, you were quite content in high school to be Barry Obama, no mention of Kenya and no mention of struggle to identify - your classmates said you were just fine.

    13.)An Ebony Article Moved Me To Run For Office - LIAR, Ebony has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn’t, and never did, exist.

    14.) A Life Magazine Article Changed My Outlook On Life - LIAR, Life has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn’t, and never did, exist.

    15.) I Won’t Run On A National Ticket In ‘08 - LIAR, here you are, despite saying, live on TV, that you would not have enough experience by then, and you are all about having experience first.

    16.) Present Votes Are Common In Illinois - LIAR, they are common for YOU, but not many others have 130 NO VOTES.

    17.) Oops, I Misvoted - LIAR, only when caught by church groups and democrats, did you beg to change your misvote.

    18.) I Was A Professor Of Law - LIAR, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE.

    19.) I Was A Constitutional Lawyer - LIAR, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE.

    20.) Without Me, There Would Be No Ethics Bill - LIAR, you didn’t write it,introduce it, change it, or create it.

    21.) The Ethics Bill Was Hard To Pass - LIAR, it took just 14 days from start to finish.

    22.) I Wrote A Tough Nuclear Bill - LIAR, your bill was rejected by your own party for its pandering and lack of all regulation - mainly because of your Nuclear Donor, Exelon, from which David Axelrod came.

    23.) I Have Released My State Records - LIAR, as of March, 2008, state bills you sponsored or voted for have yet to be released, exposing all the special interests pork hidden within.

    24.) I Took On The Asbestos Altgeld Gardens Mess - LIAR, you were part of a large group of people who remedied Altgeld Gardens. You failed to mention anyone else but yourself, in your books.

    25.) My Economics Bill Will Help America - LIAR, your 111 economic policies were just combined into a proposal which lost 99-0, and even YOU voted against your own bill.

    26.) I Have Been A Bold Leader In Illinois - LIAR, even your own supporters claim to have not seen BOLD action on your part.

    27.) I Passed 26 Of My Own Bills In One Year - LIAR, they were not YOUR bills, but rather handed to you, after their creation by a fellow Senator, to assist you in a future bid for higher office.

    28.) No One Contacted Canada About NAFTA - LIAR, the Candian Government issued the names and a memo of the conversation your campaign had with them.

    29.) I Am Tough On Terrorism - LIAR, you missed the Iran Resolution vote on terrorism and your good friend Ali Abunimah supports the destruction of Israel.

    30.) I Am Not Acting As President Yet - LIAR, after the NAFTA Memo, a dead terrorist in the FARC, in Colombia, was found with a letter stating how you and he were working together on getting FARC recognized officially.

    31.) I Didn’t Run Ads In Florida - LIAR, you allowed national ads to run 8-12 times per day for two weeks - and you still lost.

    32.) I Won Michigan - LIAR, no you didn’t.

    33.) I won Nevada - LIAR, no you did not.

    34.) I Want All Votes To Count - LIAR, you said let the delegates decide.

    35.) I Want Americans To Decide - LIAR, you prefer caucuses that limit the vote, confuse the voters, force a public vote, and only operate during small windows of time.

    36.) I passed 900 Bills in the State Senate - LIAR, you passed 26, most of which you didn’t write yourself.

    37.) My Campaign Was Extorted By A Friend - LIAR, that friend is threatening to sue if you do not stop saying this. Obama has stopped saying this.

    38.) I Believe In Fairness, Not Tactics - LIAR, you used tactics to eliminate Alice Palmer from running against you.

    39.) I Don’t Take PAC Money - LIAR, you take loads of it.

    40.) I don’t Have Lobbysists - LIAR, you have over 47 lobbyists, and counting.

    41.) My Campaign Had Nothing To Do With The 1984 Ad - LIAR, your own campaign worker made the ad on his Apple in one afternoon.

    42.) My Campaign Never Took Over MySpace - LIAR, Tom, who started MySpace issued a warning about this advertising to MySpace clients.

    43.) I Inspire People With My Words - LIAR, you inspire people with other people’s words.

    44.) I Have Passed Bills In The U.S. Senate - LIAR, you have passed A BILL in the U.S. Senate - for Africa, which shows YOUR priorities.

    45.) I Have Always Been Against Iraq - LIAR, you weren’t in office to vote against it AND you have voted to fund it every single time, unlike Kucinich, who seems to be out gutting you Obama. You also seem to be stepping back from your departure date - AGAIN.

    46.) I Have Always Supported Universal Health Care - LIAR, your plan leaves us all to pay the 15,000,000 who don’t have to buy it.

    47.) I Only Found Out About My Investment Conflicts Via Mail - LIAR, both companies you site as having sent you letters about this conflict have no record of any such letter ever being created or sent.

    48.) I Am As Patriotic As Anyone - LIAR, you won’t wear a flag pin and you don’t put your hand over your heart during the Anthem.

    49.) My Wife Didn’t Mean What She Said About Pride In Country - LIAR, your wife’s words follow lock-step in the vein of Wright and Farrahkan, in relation to their contempt and hatred of America.

    50.) Wal-Mart Is A Company I Wouldn’t Support - LIAR, your wife has received nearly a quater of a million dollars through Treehouse, which is connected to Wal-Mart.

    51.) Treehouse Is A Small Company - LIAR, the CEO of Treehouse last year, made more than the CEO of Wal-Mart, according to public records.

    52.) University Of Chicago Hospital Pay Is Fair - LIAR, your wife’s pay raise was nearly 150% her already bloated rate and the hospital is a Non-Profit Hospital, which made $100,000,000 in the last 3 years. They overcharge blacks VS whites for services, and overcharge everyone in general by 538%!

    53.)I Barely Know Rezko - Only 5 Billed Hours - LIAR, you have known him for 17 years, and decided to do a real estate deal with him during a time when he was proven to be under investigation. Despite this, you divided your property and had them take off $300K before the mortgage problems started. Then Rezko’s wife buys the lot beside it that you can’t afford, saving you $625,000.

    54.) My Donations Have Been Checked Thoroughly - LIAR, you only gave back Hsu ($72K) and Rezko (first $66K, then when caught lying $86K, then when caught lying again $150K and now caught lying YET AGAIN OBAMA, it’s $250k) their money when publically called on their involvement in your campaigns.

    55.) My Church Is Like Any Other Christian Church - LIAR, your church is so extreme, the pastor who married you, Rev. Wright, just got done blaming the US for 9/11 and named Louis Farrahkan their person of the year.

    56.) I Disagree With My Church All The Time - LIAR, you still have yet to repudiate Wright, who married you and your wife, and you still donate large sums of money to assist the church in furthering its message - hatred and revenge. You donated in 2006 alone, $22,500 to the church that you so terribly disagree with. That is nearly $500 PER WEEK - that sure is disagreement, Senator Obama.

    57.) I Have Clean Connections Despite Rezko - LIAR, you are not only connected to Exelon and Rezko, you are also connected to Hillary PAC supporter Mr. Hsu, AND an Iraqi Billionaire of ill repute, Nadhmi Auchi, who ripped off people in the Food For Oil, Iraqi deal. Seems Mr. Auchi may have helped Obama buy his million dollar property long before Obama had millions of dollars. Wonder what favors Mr. Auchi expects, when Obama leaves Iraq free to be taken over by special interests such as him.

    58.) I never heard sermons like Rev. Wright’s, that have been in videos all day, You Tube - LIAR! 3 days later during your Mea Culpa BS speech you said “Did I hear controversial statements while I sat in that church? Yes I did.”

    59.) The Passport Invasion is a conspiracy to find dirt on me! - LIAR. Your own Campaign Foreign Policy Advisor is the CEO of the company that looked into your records. PS - You had them look into yours to hide the fact you looked into Clinton’s and McCain’s more than a year before!

    60.) Rev. Meeks has nothing to do with my campaigning - LIAR. Rev. Meeks appeared in ads for your Senate Campaign, donated to you, and helped raise money, then AND NOW. PS - He also seems to despise America.

    61.) My wife didn’t mean America is ignorant, she was just using a phrase - LIAR. Again, MicHELLe’s comments perfectly sync with Wright’s, Meeks’, and Farrakhans, both in language, anger, and direction.

    62.) I am very Anti-Terror - LIAR. [03/30/2008] One of your good pals is long time radical and terrorist William Ayers, with whom you have been seen in the last 12 months and who has helped the now jailed khalidi, Professor at Columbia who invited Ahmadinejad to the University, to raise money for Palestinian terrorism attacks against Israel. PS - Your church published a pro Hamas Manifesto - guess you weren’t there on THAT Sunday either? How lucky for you.

    63.) I have the best plan to cure the Mortgage Crisis - LIAR. [03/30/2008] You and your campaign buddy Penny SubPrime Bank Collapse Prizker have had your little fingers full of subprime cash - Obama has taken $1,180,103 from the top issuers of subprime loans: Obama received $266,907 from Lehman, $5395 from GMAC, $150,850 from Credit Suisse First Boston, $11,250 from Countrywide, $9052 from Washington Mutual, $161,850 from Citigroup, $4600 from CBASS, $170,050 from Morgan Stanley, $1150 from Centex, and last but certainly NOT LEAST - Obama received $351,900 from Goldman Sachs. I am sure that cash all came from folks who knew the subprime loan they had was a dream, eh?

    64) I played greater role in crafting liberal stands on gun control, the death penalty and abortion - LIAR - [03/31/2008] It was found that Obama — the day after sitting for the interview — filed an amended version of the questionnaire, which appears to contain Obama’s own handwritten notes added to one answer. Read Obama had greater role on liberal survey

    65) I did NOT play the race card: - LIAR - [03/31/2008] Obama was the first to play the race card. According to Phialdelphia Inquirer, Quietly, the storm over the hateful views expressed by Sen. Barack Obama’s pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, has blown away the most insidious myth of the Democratic primary campaign. Obama and his surrogates have charged that Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton has deliberately and cleverly played the race card in order to label Obama the “black” candidate. Read more here

    66) I did not take money from oil companies: - LIAR - [03/31/2008]

    THE FACTS: True enough, Obama does not take money from oil companies. No candidate does. It is illegal for corporations to give money to politicians. Corporations, however, do have political action committees that collect voluntary donations from employees and then donate them to candidates. Obama doesn’t take money from PACs. He also doesn’t take money from lobbyists.

    But he does accept money from executives and other employees of oil companies and two of his fundraisers are oil company executives. As of Feb. 29, Obama’s presidential campaign had received nearly $214,000 from oil and gas industry employees and their families, according to an analysis by the nonpartisan Center for Responsive Politics. Clinton had received nearly $307,000 from industry workers and their families and Republican Sen. John McCain, the likely GOP presidential nominee, received nearly $394,000, according to the center’s totals.

    Two of Obama’s fundraisers are Robert Cavnar, the chairman and chief executive of Houston-based Mission Resources Corp., and George Kaiser, the president and CEO of Tulsa-based Kaiser-Francis Oil Co. Source: Associated press via Yahoo News

    67) “I don’t think my church is actually particularly controversial,” Obama said at a community meeting in Nelsonville, Ohio, earlier this month. - LIAR - But yesterday, he told a different story. “Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes,” he said in his speech yesterday in Philadelphia.

    68) Look at my education record in Illinois - LIAR - In reality, Obama never really championed the local councils. He supported them behind the scenes and only eventually came out publicly on their behalf. When he did weigh in, he came down on the wrong side of the debate—against protecting principals from unwarranted dismissals and in favor of keeping councils independent, no matter what. In the end, the resolution of the conflict between the two sides didn’t alleviate anyone’s concerns. Instead, it prolonged a turf battle that seems to have dragged down academic progress in the years since. Read more here http://www.slate.com/id/2188010?wpisrc=newsletter
    Source: slate.com

    Source: ABC News: Buried in Eloquence, Obama Contradictions About Pastor

    This is the LAUNDRY LIST OF LIES. Updated to reflect new dishonesties.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Could we have a link, please
    al-Bob Al?

    ReplyDelete
  3. Is Barack Obama the Messiah?

    "... a light will shine through that window, a beam of light will come down upon you, you will experience an epiphany ... and you will suddenly realize that you must go to the polls and vote for Obama"

    - Barack Obama Lebanon, New Hampshire.
    January 7, 2008.

    ---

    "We are the ones we've been waiting for.

    We are the change that we seek."

    - YouTube - Obama, Super Tuesday

    ---
    For the Word has become Flash.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Born of humble origins, the son of an African goatherder, in a wasteland society of defect, the hero endures a perilous youth, a period of deep inner searching, experiences a separation from his society and the world, and then a penetration to some transcendent source of power; thus enlightened, he returns with a life enhancing boon to share with his fellows for the benefit of his society. The circulation of the life enhancing, life supporting energy of the universe restored, he is universally acclaimed.

    OBMAMA '08!

    ReplyDelete
  5. OBAMA '08!

    darnnit i worked hard on that too

    ReplyDelete
  6. With all the money pouring in, the Word becomes Flush:)

    ReplyDelete
  7. Will we Flush the Flash,
    or have we become Flaccid?

    ReplyDelete
  8. The latest New York Times/CBS News poll.

    The poll showed that Mr. Obama now leads Senator John McCain of Arizona, the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, 47 percent to 42 percent; his lead was 50 percent to 38 percent in late February, when Mr. McCain still faced primary opposition from Mike Huckabee. The latest poll shows Mrs. Clinton leading Mr. McCain, 48 percent to 43 percent, in a similar match-up.


    The nationwide telephone poll was conducted with 1,196 registered voters, including

    510 Democratic primary voters and 323 Republican primary voters.

    WTF?

    ReplyDelete
  9. Barack Hussein Obama Marched in AND HELPED ORGANIZE! The Million Man March

    By Debbie Schlussel
    Well, well, well. This is the kind of Prez you will have in the White House come January, if you do not vote for John McCain:
    Barack Hussein Obama not only marched in but helped ORGANIZE the so-called "Million Man March" presided over and led by racist loon Louis Farrakhan in 1995.
    (Actually, it was the 100,000 Man March if you use real, non-Ebonics math.)

    At the march, Farrakhan and a whole cornucopia of racist lunatics engaged in a torrent of anti-Semitic, anti-White, and anti-American speeches. The event was put on by the Nation of Islam, but Obama's "not a Muslim," so end of story, right?
    (Just kidding. April Fools Day was yesterday.)

    Read all the details on this latest disturbing B Hussein O info at
    Gateway Pundit
    and
    Bob McCarty .

    ReplyDelete
  10. The true face of Leonardo Da Vinci:

    http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/235

    ReplyDelete
  11. Stephen Hawking: Asking big questions about the universe

    http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/242

    ReplyDelete
  12. Bobal: 7.) I Never Practiced Islam - LIAR, you practiced it daily at school, where you were registered as a Muslim and kept that faith for 31 years,until your wife made you change, so you could run for office.

    Bobal, you disappoint. Sure he was registered as a Muslim at age six, but he didn't register himself as a Muslim, he was too busy studying the Roman Catholic Catechism.

    At first, Obama attended the Catholic school, Fransiskus Assisis, where documents showed he enrolled as a Muslim, the religion of his stepfather.

    The document required that each student choose one of five state-sanctioned religions when registering - Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Catholic or Protestant. Gibbs said he wasn't sure why the document had Obama listed as a Muslim.

    "Senator Obama has never been a Muslim," Gibbs said. "As a six-year-old in Catholic school, he studied the catechism."

    ReplyDelete
  13. Aenea,

    You're very strange. Are you trying to say that Baraka Hussein Obama is not a LIAR and a "Trojan Horse"?

    ReplyDelete
  14. Some afternoons, my father might say, “Shall we have lobster tonight?” He’d steer for the nearest lobster pot. As a child, I found this thrilling beyond belief, for it was established lore that a Maine lobsterman could legally shoot you on sight if he caught you plundering his livelihood.

    After laborious heavings on the line, the trap would come up, suddenly alive with frantic, jackknifing lobsters. The trick was getting them out without having them clamp down on your fingers. My father would then put two bottles of whisky into the lobster pot as payment. I always wondered what the lobsterman thought upon bringing up his trap to find two fifths of Johnnie Walker Black inside. Did he scratch his head and say, “Reckon Mr. Buckley’s back”?

    ReplyDelete
  15. Metuselah: You're very strange. Are you trying to say that Baraka Hussein Obama is not a LIAR and a "Trojan Horse"?

    If you insist on a religious test for the office of President, at least disqualify Obama for the religion he has embraced as an adult rather than the religion his father signed him up for as a child (which is very much like dinging Obama for what his pastor says). Otherwise you come across as an ignorant bigot and that won't take you very far.

    ReplyDelete
  16. aenea, what concerns me about Obama is, from whatever his exposure to islam, he may unconsciously harbor some ill will toward the gay community, even though he says he doesn't. He'll say anything, you know.

    ReplyDelete
  17. If you insist on a religious test for the office of President, at least disqualify Obama for the religion he has embraced as an adult rather

    Well good grief, and I mean this, he belongs to a cockeyed racist America hating Africa allegiance church that blames all the world's woes on the white man, whose pastor all his time at the church is a total charlatan. That's
    reason enough, right there.

    If it's not good enough for Oprah it's not good enough for me!

    ReplyDelete
  18. Aenea: "Otherwise you come across as an ignorant bigot and that won't take you very far."

    Bigot? You betchya!
    Ignorant? I think not.

    When Baraka Hussein Obama is revealed as a muslim trojan horse, Baraka Hussein Obama claims ignorance as to who and what those he associates most closely with are.

    So question is, do you believe Baraka Hussein Obama claim of ignorance when the overwhelming evidence indicates long term deliberate collusion. If you do, please explain why.

    ReplyDelete
  19. Mat, we had a nice lady here for awhile, claimed she was gay, and discriminated against. Turned out none of it was true. I think you're on to something, not taking at face value what people say as necessarily being true. It seems to be a good rule in life, to look a little deeper.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Metuselah: When Baraka Hussein Obama is revealed as a muslim trojan horse, Baraka Hussein Obama claims ignorance as to who and what those he associates most closely with are.

    I see. Islam is the new Communism. "Are you now or have you ever been a member of Islam?" When you say Obama is a Trojan Horse do you base this on evidence or on irrational fear?

    So question is, do you believe Baraka Hussein Obama claim of ignorance when the overwhelming evidence indicates long term deliberate collusion. If you do, please explain why.

    In the context of politics, I don't care about a politician's religious beliefs, I care about their policies. To the extent that I do care about a person's religious beliefs, I'm only interested in those beliefs they have embraced by their own free will, not the beliefs of the religion they were compelled to attend as a child by their parents. I do not lay the actions of a person's associates (such as Reverend Wright) at the feet of that person. I hold people to account for what THEY say and do, not what the people AROUND them say and do. I do not believe a person needs to kill their relationship with another person if that other person holds radical beliefs, because I don't believe people are mindless robots programmed by their pastors. If Reverend Wright was running for President, however, I would have a problem. I believe all these attitudes I have spelled out are cracker-barrel folksy good American horse sense.

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  21. Bobal: Mat, we had a nice lady here for awhile, claimed she was gay, and discriminated against. Turned out none of it was true.

    Maybe it was an understanding. Maybe she was talking about going to Burger King, having it her way, "hold the pickle".

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  22. I don't know, aenea. She put on a pretty good show. One time, she was saying how tough it was, being gay, and not being allowed in the hospital to visit her friend. Had me almost blubbering. Wasn't anything about holding a pickle at Burger King.

    Anyways, she's gone now.

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  23. Bobal: aenea, what concerns me about Obama is, from whatever his exposure to islam, he may unconsciously harbor some ill will toward the gay community, even though he says he doesn't. He'll say anything, you know.

    "[Obama] supports the complete repeal of DOMA*. which is the same position he has held since early 2004," Obama spokesman Ben LaBolt told ABC News.

    "I want to repeal Sec. 3 of DOMA, which stands in the way of the extension of benefits to people in committed same-sex marriages, and, you know, I will be very strongly in favor of doing that as president," said [Hillary] Clinton at Thursday's forum.

    * 1996 Defense of Marriage Act, signed by Billary.

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  24. Doug: At the march, Farrakhan and a whole cornucopia of racist lunatics engaged in a torrent of anti-Semitic, anti-White, and anti-American speeches. The event was put on by the Nation of Islam, but Obama's "not a Muslim," so end of story, right?

    You guys insisting that a man is really a Muslim when he confesses Christ as his Lord and Savior remind of a song by Suicidal Tendancies:

    I was in my room and I was just like staring at the wall thinking about everything

    But then again I was thinking about nothing

    And then my mom came in and I didn't even know she was there she called my name

    And I didn't even hear it, and then she started screaming: MIKE! MIKE!

    And I go:
    What, what's the matter

    And she goes:
    What's the matter with you?

    I go:
    There's nothing-wrong mom.

    And she goes:
    Don't tell me that, you're on drugs!

    And I go:
    No mom I'm not on drugs I'm okay, I was just thinking you know, why don't you get me a Pepsi.

    And she goes:
    NO you're on drugs!

    I go:
    Mom I'm okay, I'm just thinking.

    She goes:
    No you're not thinking, you're on drugs! Normal people don't act that way!

    I go:
    Mom just give me a Pepsi please

    All I want is a Pepsi, and she wouldn't give it to me

    All I wanted was a Pepsi, just one Pepsi, and she wouldn't give it to me. Just a Pepsi.

    They give you a white shirt with long sleeves
    Tied around you're back, you're treated like thieves
    Drug you up because they're lazy
    It's too much work to help a crazy

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  25. Well thank allah to hear Obama has come out against marriage!

    Now all we have to do is broaden our understanding of human relationships to include polygamy, again, and every other last other permutation you can think of, and good times will be here for all, of whatever age.

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  26. Bobal: I don't know, aenea. She put on a pretty good show. One time, she was saying how tough it was, being gay, and not being allowed in the hospital to visit her friend. Had me almost blubbering. Wasn't anything about holding a pickle at Burger King.

    I think I know your neighborhood girl. The Elephant Bar often posted pictures of hotties, like when the Vietnam Vets used put up pinup girls in the machine shop at the Bonneville Power Adminstration complex in Vancouver Washington back in the 70s and 80s. She wanted to fit in. Worked her way up to silver cluster. Then it all went to shi'ite.

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  27. I don't think Obama is particularily religious at all. Nor Wright, the charlatan. I think he joined up with Wright as a politcal move to bolster his bonavides with certain groups at the time when he needed to do so. And, truth is, you can tell a lot about a person by who they hang out with.

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  28. Well, this girl wasn't shy, I'll tell you. Said she'd licked more pussy than Hillary. Wasn't shy at all, made some of us blush:) She knew a lot about literature and stuff though. Claimed she was a catholic taoist for awhile. I gotta run, take care, aenea.

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  29. Bobal: Now all we have to do is broaden our understanding of human relationships to include polygamy, again, and every other last other permutation you can think of, and good times will be here for all, of whatever age.

    You suggested that Obama harbored ill-will toward the gay community. As you know, the DOMA creates a second, inferior class of marriage for same-sex couples by relieving other states and the federal government from the obligation under the "full faith and credit" clause of the Constitution to recognize such marriages contracted in states where it is legal, such as Massechusettes. McCain wants to leave the DOMA in place and would even strengthen it with a Federal Marriage Amendment. Hillary wants to leave it largely intact (protecting the right of states to exclude such marriages) but roll back the narrower definition of marriage as it applies to federal agencies. This is a form of Dick Morris style triangulation. Obama wants to repeal it altogether. Anyway, that's how the Final Three stand.

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  30. Maybe tonight we will do a booty call.

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  31. I remember she really knew her Huck Finn. But not perfectly, cause there's a passage in that book, where Huck pulls a fib and trick on Jim, and Jim finds out eventually, and shames Huck for it, coming off the better person. I think she'd forgotten about that passage.

    Obviously I don't think Obama harbors ill will towards the gay community.

    I'll second that, deuce. Something steamy, yet graceful.

    Now I really gotta run.

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  32. Aenea: "I see. Islam is the new Communism."

    It is. And much more dangerous than Communism. But we'll get to that later. For now, the question is do you believe Baraka Hussein Obama claim of ignorance as it pertains to his close associates and family? You didn't answer that question, you only said that it's not an issue for you.

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  33. Metuselah: For now, the question is do you believe Baraka Hussein Obama claim of ignorance as it pertains to his close associates and family? You didn't answer that question, you only said that it's not an issue for you.

    Precisely. And because Obama's religious beliefs are not an issue for me, I don't care what Obama knew about the beliefs of the people around him. I'm not electing Obama to Caliph or Pope. I keep my own counsel on religious issues. Only his public policy positions are relevant to me. And this is in conformity with the US Constitution. Bush may be shredding amendment 4 but he hasn't got the whole document in the shitter yet.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_religious_test_clause

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  34. Words which for eons have meant something are being redefined so that they mean nothing.

    Marriage - Redefining marriage to mean any combination essentially makes it mean nothing.

    Gender - Case in point, a transgendered person who is in fact a woman (sorry, can't get past the chromosone thing) and although appearing to be a man has now become pregnant.

    Reproductive rights - euphemism for abortion.

    In addition, I have a problem with those claiming to be Christian, such as Mr. Obama, who have no problem with abortion and are even opposed to a ban on partial birth abortion.

    Lastly, call me a bigot but I absolutely would never vote for an atheist.

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  35. So I'll take it, Aenea, that Baraka Hussein Obama claim of ignorance doesn't quite fly with you either. Good, that's settled. Now, to your argument that religious beliefs don't intertwine with the political, and therefore are inconsequential. History has proven this to be an ignorant and false assertion, so I know you'll find yourself in a distinct minority on that score. Furthermore, because the falsehood in your assertion, particularly as it concerns Islamic ideology is so egregious, what you have in fact done is put yourself in a position of being a active taqqiyya shill for Islam and Islamers world-over. Same as Ashley. And my conversation with you is over.

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  36. Bushitler. The most evil man since Franklin Roosevelt.

    Many of my neighbors have disappeared. Whispered between those of us who remain are reports of squads of black-clad, balaclavaed men snatching our neighbors in the middle of the night.

    Some who have dared question the pogrom have been detained and tortured.

    There are also rumors that huge concentration camps exist in the remote corners of Federal lands as well as some of the larger military bases.

    May God save us all from the evil one, George W. Bush. Lord, send us a Saviour. Send Obama.

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  37. ..an active taqqiyya shill for Islam and Islamers..

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  38. Being an atheist is making a claim to knowing the unknowable. It is a disbelief in facts not presented. On the other hand, a believer in anything else, is expressing conviction that their belief is built on faith.

    Take your pick, a disbeliever in the unknowable or faith in the unknown.

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  39. Other words that have been twisted to mean anything or nothing:

    Torture.
    Sin.

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  40. I was for Hillary before I was against her.

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  41. Don't call me a bigot, but I couldn't vote for a moslem, ever. It's not bigotry because I have perfectly sane, secular, and even spiritual reasons for not doing so. I couldn't vote for a former moslem either, as I could never be sure the de-programming had worked, or that it wasn't just an excellent fake-a-roo.

    Though I think atheism walks on a lot thinner ice than theism, I could vote for some atheists. There are hard, and soft, atheists. Some are dogmatic, others not so much, kinda slidding over into agnosticism really. Like unca Jerry. I could have voted for him. Wonderful guy, claimed to be an atheist, thought there was just too much suffering in the world, etc. When really pushed, he'd sort of slide over into agnosticism.

    William James says that those people who have had certain experiences--that those experiences are--can't remember his words--but sufficient, compelling, for them. People reading or listening to such testimony can't be convinced in the same way. Atheism seems unable to point to anything like this, at least in the same way.

    Then there's all that near death literature I put some credence in, and the myths. And love. too.

    I think a person isn't getting a whole picture who doesn't see the possiblity of some wider something that may be true, than the old, it's just...it's just...the old reductionist outlook.

    We really can't even explain how it is that the light that enters our eyes gives us a representation of the world, though we know now it doesn't give us even a very accurate picture of the world.

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