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Friday, December 30, 2011

Predictions for 2011 (Post Facto). How did he do?


  1. The trend lines are accurate, some of the timing was a bit premature.

    Violent crime has not escalated.

    Whether of not Mr Bernanke is a criminal, still subject to political debate.

  2. But then again, it is safer to be a Marine in Afghanistan than in Florida.

    Police say Lt. Col. Karl Trenker was shot while trying to sell a gold necklace that his fiancée had advertised on Craigslist. A Marine Corps spokesman said Thursday that Trenker is in stable condition and recovering well from the Dec. 21 shooting.

    Trenker tells WSVN-TV that he can't believe he was shot. He says he went to Iraq and Afghanistan multiple times and returned without being injured, only to be wounded in Deerfield Beach.

  3. The Schofield Kid: Yeah, well, I guess they had it coming.

    Will Munny: We all got it coming, kid.

  4. Rense and Repeat

    Love the fake hair, tan, and demeanor.

    Celente and Rense bash War Mongering, Peace Prize winning President BO, Michael Moore and...
    Denounce the coming of WWIII.

    How can anyone sleep?

  5. Egypt raids 3 U.S. aid agencies...

    Computers, files seized; Staff detained...

    New tensions...


    Predictably, President Hussein fanned the flames of revolt in Egypt after squelching same in Iran.

    Ever one to encourage our enemies and punish our allies.

  6. I guess John Corzine didn't show up on ol' Celente's radar, eh? Celente's Gold Account was Looted by M.F. Global

  7. desert rat: Violent crime has not escalated.

    Kill-adelphia: Yet again, city tops list of homicide rates

    Philadelphia Daily News
    farrs@phillynews.com 215-854-4225

    Post a comment
    90 unsolved slayings in 2011 Slayings that made headlines in 2011


    Ex-KYW employee files sex-harassment suit

    Yet again, city tops list of homicide rates
    Small town takes on big gas firm

    Noted local guitarist found shot dead

    Zoning by fiat may be on the way out
    ON THE DOOR into the Uceta Mini Market in North Philadelphia, a sign warns shoppers, "No Weapons Allowed."

    Inside, the message on a sign sandwiched between cigarette ads is even more blunt: "Stop. Shooting. People."

    The market sits at Stillman and Somerset streets, just steps from the scenes of two recent gun slayings that remain unsolved. But in the store, where you can buy everything from milk to motor oil, the signs are an ignored, endured part of everyday existence - just like the homicides themselves.

    This is among the city's most dangerous neighborhoods, where violence is as ingrained as the futility many feel that it will ever abate.

    "I know a lot of people who got killed, maybe 10, I don't know how many," Marcus Henry, 29, said yesterday as he got his morning coffee.

    Flash Mob Violence – Wisconsin State Fair Ends With Violent Race Based Flash Mob Beatings……

    August 10, 2011, 12:12 PM
    Philadelphia Fights Violent Flash Mobs With Curfews

    June 13, 2011
    Chicago's Violent Flash Mobs
    By Robert Klein Engler

    Stories about violent "flash mobs" roaming Chicago's North Side neighborhoods have been in the news the past 2 weeks. People are worried about the impact these mobs will have on tourism and the city's economy. Some are asking why this social unrest is happening, now, so soon after Mayor Daley left office.

    Md. Police On Alert For Flash Mob Robberies
    August 18, 2011 11:37 PM

    BALTIMORE (WJZ)– “Flash mob” robberies. It’s a disturbing trend in Philadelphia, Washington D.C. and right here in Maryland. Large groups of young people swarm stores, take what they want and leave just as fast.

    Yep, no matter HOW you wish to measure.... America is a peaceful, fun loving nation.

  8. Facts are facts.
    There is crime, but less than there was, before.

    Whether reality fits your private fears, not my concern.

    Like it or not,
    it is what it is.

    Mon Dec 19, 2011

    (Reuters) - Murders, rapes and other violent crimes dropped sharply in the United States in the first six months of 2011, continuing a downward trend that has lasted 4 1/2 years, the FBI reported on Monday.

  9. Even, it appears, in Meryland


    Violent crime decreased nationally in 2011, and officials say the trend appears to be occurring in Maryland as well.

    Montgomery County reported 15 homicides in 2011 compared to 17 in 2010, said police spokeswoman Angela Cruz.

    Overall, violent crimes fell nationally by 6.4 percent from January to June 2011, compared to the same time last year, according to preliminary FBI data.

    The FBI classifies the following as violent crimes: murder and non-negligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery, and aggravated assault.

    Maryland officials said they were not ready to give out statewide crime figures for 2011, but anecdotally, evidence suggests crime went down in 2011.

  10. That should be Maryland, with an "A" not an "e".

  11. But anon can fan the flames of fear, even when the facts are stacked against him.

    Typical of an anoni.

  12. Who will be the next president? Not who do you want but who do you expect to be elected?

  13. New York Times on Tehran and Nukes

    Tehran’s latest threat to block global oil shipping should leave no doubt about its recklessness and its contempt for international law. This is not a government any country should want to see acquire nuclear weapons.

  14. Deuce said...
    Who will be the next president? Not who do you want but who do you expect to be elected?

    Fri Dec 30, 10:49:00 AM EST


    Somebody other than Ron Paul.

  15. Southern Bapists wage War on Fire and Brimstone.

    ...as represented by Global Warming.

  16. It is not a question, doug, of "should" any country want to see Iran obtain a nuclear weapon.

    It is a question of what the United States "should" do about it.

    How high a price "should" the US pay, to achieve a nuclear free Iran?

    What is the cost/benefit of US intervention?

  17. Low cost, high benefit, if done intelligently.

  18. Mr Obama, Deuce, will win re-election.

    The GOP base will either fragment or a large portion of it will stay home on election day.

  19. If they try to close Hormuz, we close their one refinery and close out their "navy"

    Hussein would be re-elected.

  20. The question for the GOP ...

    Do they chose a transitional figure, like Mr Goldwater or do they replicate a Bob Dole clone?

    They seem to moving towards the Bob Dole paradigm.

  21. The only way to keep a country the size of Iran from having a nuke is to "Invade, Conquer, and OCCUPY" said country.


  22. Hussein could re-purpose closed-out Paki Drones to orbit Iran's nuclear efforts, firing at will when appropriate.

  23. It's all going Mr Obama's way.

    While the GOP elite has once again snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

    Almost as if they planned it that way.

  24. Madness is claiming that is the only way, Ruf.

    Ethanol madness, I'd wager.

  25. We've been waging "economic war" against a small island nation 90 miles from our border for fifty years. How has That worked out?

  26. Not too well for the Cubans.

    Great for '54 Chevy Mechanics.

  27. It's still too early to call, Deuce.

    Much mud, blood, and connecting tissue has yet to be slung.

    MSM has yet to pick their candidate.

    The Puppet Masters know, though. But they ain't sayin' either, yet.

  28. It's almost all underground, doug.

    The Iranians learned the lessons of the raid on the Osirak reactor, back in 1981.

    The Iranians have had thirty years to prep for air raids against their facilities.

    The GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided bomb, the AGM-114 Hellfire II air-to-ground missiles, the AIM-9 Sidewinder,[14] and recently, the GBU-38 JDAM will not get that job done.

  29. There are pipelines running all through Iran from Russia, Kazakhstan, etc. And, while you're shutting down their refinery, you're taking another 2 1/2 Million, or so, barrels/day of oil off the global market.

    And, quite possibly, 40% of ALL the exported oil in the world. A month of that, and you can stick a fork in our asses. We'd be done.

  30. Viruses have done quite well above ground as well as below.
    Above ground assasinations affect the work below.

    ONE Refinery.

  31. Rufus doubles the probable amount of Oil "impacted."

    ...and I'd bet on the US Navy over Iran's efforts.

    No contest, really.

  32. The Iranians have said they'd close the Straits, if they were embargoed.

    Embargoes are an act of war.

    In reading the news reports, of the sanctions proposed by the Europeons, the terms sanction and embargo are both used, almost interchangeably.

    There is a whirled of difference, 'tween the two.

  33. Iran is 636,000 Sq Miles.

    That's 4 Times the Size of California.

  34. Really? How much oil do you think is "exported," Doug?

  35. No, doug, 40% of the whirled's oil does flow through the Straits of Hormuz.

    The Iranians do have Chinese anti-ship missiles, of the type that hit an Israeli man-o-war, off the coast of Lebanon.

    The tankers would be easy pickings.
    The missile launchers mounted upon pickup trucks.

    The US unable to out a SINGLE mobile Scud launcher during Desert Storm.
    Those are much larger and less mobile than pickup trucks.

  36. Rufus II said...
    Iran is 636,000 Sq Miles.

    That's 4 Times the Size of California.


    YOU think we'd need to occupy, not me.

    Like 'Rat, I favor sabotage, or if they commit an act of War against us, (again) taking them out economically for a time.

  37. This deal is being promoted by the same assholes that have kept us in perpetual war since WWII.

    It's time for a hale, and hearty "Fuck You."

  38. "The strait at its narrowest is 54 kilometres (34 mi) wide.[1] It is the only sea passage to the open ocean for large areas of the petroleum-exporting Persian Gulf. About 13 tankers carrying 15.5 million barrels (2,460,000 m3) of crude oil pass through the strait on an average day, making it one of the world's most strategically important choke points. This represents 33% of the world's seaborne oil shipments, and 17 percent of oil traded worldwide in 2009.[2]"

  39. The CIA was "all over" a backward little country called Pakistan. They said an ant couldn't fart, there, without them knowing.

    They found out about Pakistan's nukes the same day we did. The day Pakistan popped one off.

  40. Bomb their ONE refinery, you've started a war.

    Start a war, they close the Straits.

    For how long, depends upon the lengths the US would go to, to continue the war with Iran.

    Or what lengths the US would go to, to end the war.

    There would be unintended consequences, without doubt.

  41. And for what, the Iranian nuclear program has not advanced, since 1992, if Bibi and the Mossad man are both to be believed.

    The Iranians are still three to five years from developing a weapon, same as Bibi said, in 1992.

    Twenty years on, of not developing a nuclear weapon.

  42. The US will not bomb Iran, based on the latest talk and sabre rattling. Aint gonna happen.

  43. There are 5 or 6 Iranians over there that need killing, but the rest just want to be Westerners.

  44. I'm with you, 'Rat:
    Sabotage is fine.

    If THEY make good on their threat to close Hormuz, we take them out, economically.

    their move.

  45. Exports were Way Down in 2009, Doug. I'll stick with the 40% of Exported Oil.

    But, what the fuck is the difference between 33 and 40%?

    You close the Staits for a month and you have a global catastrophe.

    And, for what?

    So the Koch Brothers, and Lester Crown can become richer, and me and you can become poorer?

    Why in the fuck should You and I support that?

  46. Embargoes are sanctions.
    But sanctions are not necessarily embargoes, gag.

    If the Europeons chose not to buy Iranian oil, that's not war.

    If the Europeons attempt to stop Iran from shipping oil, that's war.

    It's a matter of degree.

  47. And, the Europeans have lost their everloving minds. What are they going to do when that Chinese tanker pulls into the Gulf for a load of that Iranian Crude?

  48. Chicken hawks are birds

    Not all birds are chicken hawks.

  49. Here, take another 3 million Barrels/Day off This Puppy

    and tell me how your world is rocking.

  50. Earth to EB:

    IRAN, not Obama threatens to close the straights.

  51. I was gonna ask about that graph, Rufus:

    Real journalists have captions explaining WTF is being "graphically represented."

  52. You don't understand the nomenclature, Doug. "Oil traded worldwide" would include oil drilled in Texas, and sold in Louisiana.

    Seaborne shipments is closer to exports, but that doesn't even cover oil such as that produced in Canada, and pipelined to the U.S.

  53. "JODI" was a nympho back in my college daze.

  54. War Imminent in Straits of Hormuz?
    $200 a Barrel Oil?

    Roughly 40 percent of the world's oil tanker shipments transit the strait daily, carrying 15.5 million barrels of Saudi, Iraqi, Iranian, Kuwaiti, Bahraini, Qatari and United Arab Emirates crude oil, leading the United States Energy Information Administration to label the Strait of Hormuz "the world's most important oil chokepoint."

  55. That graph is a representation of this Data that is submitted by the oil-producing countries of the world, Doug.

    Joint Oil Data Initiative

  56. Earth to EB:

    IRAN, not Obama threatens to close the straights.

  57. Obama would have to go find it on the map first, before he could close it.

  58. That explains everything, Rufus.

    To Oil Conspiracy Nerds.

    just sayin...

  59. Iran is threatening to close the Straits if the whirled commits an act of war against Iran.

    An oil embargo is an act of war.

    Iran threatened to create chaos in the world economy Thursday by blocking a key oil supply route.

    The beligerance came as the U.S. and its allies pursued tough sanctions — including an oil embargo — to pressure Iran to abandon its fledgling nuclear program.

    As a result, Iran raised the specter of moving warships into the Strait of Hormuz to disrupt oil shipments — a move the U.S. Navy vowed to thwart.

    Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/iran-threatens-block-vital-strait-hormuz-oil-supply-route-persian-gulf-article-1.998376#ixzz1i2NjVmJz

  60. The only way Obama, and the other IEA Nations kept gasoline from blowing past $4.00/gal this year was to release a Million Barrels/Day of "Reserves" onto the world market for a couple of months this year.

    Now imagine 15 Million Barrels/Day going offline for a couple of months.

  61. "oil conspiracy nerds?"

    Do you live in such a childish dreamworld that you don't understand what moves the world economy?

  62. The "West" threatens Iran with an act of war.

    The Iranians respond in kind.

    doug blames the Iranians for their belligerence.

    Who you gonna believe?

  63. The only way Obama, and the other IEA Nations kept gasoline from blowing past $4.00/gal this year was to release a Million Barrels/Day of "Reserves" onto the world market for a couple of months this year.


    yeah, that and corn fed ethanol.

    My Ass.

    Obamie's done everything he can to raise energy prices.

    Part of the plan, as explained by BHO to the San Fran Libs.

  64. Doug, you're an idiot. Obama wants (desperately) what ALL politicians want - Another Term.

    He knows he won't get it with $5.00 gasoline, and another Recession.

  65. Earth to EB:

    News for iran threatens us

    ...but I understand:

    Paulistas always blame Amerika First.

  66. If he wanted higher oil prices he wouldn't have coordinated the Largest Release from Reserves in History.

  67. He didn't close down oil in the Gulf, Ruf?

    He isn't shutting down coal?

    He isn't delaying/abandoning the Canadian pipeline?

    I'm an idiot for believing my lyin eyes?

  68. So, doug, are you saying that increasing the supply of oil available did not keep the prices down?

    That increasing the supply available to the refineries actually was part of a plan to increase the price of gasoline?

    Please explain how that would be the effect on the supply side of the Laffer Curve.

  69. Clinton released reserves.
    Bush Built reserves.
    Obama released more reserves.
    Free money at the expense of national security.

    What's new?

  70. New oil comes out of wells.

    Stolen security comes from the reserves.

    Clinton/Obama choose the later.

  71. You're behind curve, doug.

    1 March 2011

    The Obama administration has given the greenlight for the official resumption of deepwater drilling in the Gulf of Mexico later this month. The government issued the first deepwater drilling permit to a company since the BP oil spill last year.
    Skrebowski says to get the permit, Noble Energy had to prove that it could contain a blowout. It'll be using the same capping technology that finally stopped the BP spill.

  72. "Please explain how that would be the effect on the supply side of the Laffer Curve."


    Fri Dec 30, 11:57:00 AM EST answers your
    Fri Dec 30, 11:57:00 AM EST

  73. He just opened another large area of Wyoming to coal production, Doug.

    And, he'd proposed opening a large part of the East Coast to exploration (something the oil companies don't care about because there's no oil, there) when BP, and Halliburton screwed the pooch in the Gulf of Mexico.

    My God, they damned near destroyed the economy of the whole Gulf Coast. He shut'em down until they developed a reasonable drilling plan. What the hell would YOU have done?

    The idiot pipeliners tried to run the the pipeline right over an area where the Ogallal Aquifer comes within INCHES of the surface. Even the Republican Governor of Nebraska was against that. He's making them reroute it. What would YOU have done?

    Get a grip, boyo.

  74. As the LA Times tells us ...

    After the worst offshore oil disaster in American history, the Interior Department revamped lax permitting procedures, and regulators and industry struggled to master them.

    But master them, they did.

  75. Economic security was the purpose of those reserves.

    They succeeded in providing that economic security, when the Libyan oil went off the market.

    Which occurred well before NATO intervention in Libya.

    Leaving it the reserves would not have enhanced US economic security.
    Utilizing it did.

  76. No need to worry about oil, gents.

    The new light bulb requirements start next week. Soon we will no longer have to listen to loud commercials, either.

    Our leaders are looking out for us.

  77. The USGS had literally (and, I mean, "LITERALLY") turned into nothing more than a "Prostitution Service" for the Oil Company Exectutives.

    You might have missed the headlines two years ago regarding The Sex Parties with Female USGS Executives and Oil Company Bigwigs, but some of us read other things than The American Thinker.

  78. Those stinkin' light bulbs.
    Mercury is a hazardous material.
    Even in minuscule amounts.

    The other reason to release those reserves, doug, make up for what would have come on-line, during the year it took to develop safer systems for deep water drilling.

    Our ecological and economic securities, intertwined.

    Definitely not with regard those stinkin' light bulbs.

  79. Rat, what has the Iranians upset is the US law re foreign countries doing business with the Iranian central bank.

  80. You know, doug, your reluctance to utilize the strategic oil reserves ...
    Your preference for the idea that they SHOULD be static inventory, instead of a flowing reservoir, led me to thinking of Ms Albright and Colin Powell.

    With you in the role of the General.

    Powell recalled that he almost had "an aneurysm" when Albright challenged him to explain
    "What's the point of having this superb military you're always talking about if we can't use it?"

  81. That too, ash.

    But we can do that, if we wish.
    That's a sanction.
    A choice that Iran's trading partners are free to make.

    It will effectively limit Iran's possible trading partners to China and India. Which is an item I read somewhere authoritative, the other day.

    I've long advocated for real economic sanctions in pursuit of US foreign policy goals in Iran.
    To the point of sanctions on the Whirled Bank, for funding water infrastructure projects in Iran, back a few years ago.

    Obama is taking the right approach, with Iran.

    No footprint at all.

  82. They say that is the reason to close the strait. Should the US proceed?

  83. I don't have a clue what Iran will do. But, you might ask yourself, this:

    If the U.S., and the Euros took away your ability to sell your oil, and started hurting your people with their "sanctions," What Would You Do?

  84. Keeping in mind: 600 Mile Coastline.

  85. Yeah, call their bluff.

    Because they are bluffing.

    Charlie Chi-com will pick up their slack, at a discount.
    Which Charlie needs, what with their own export "slow down".
    That's a win-win for US interests.

    The economic pressure further limits the Iranians ability to project political power into Lebanon and Syria.
    Let alone Bahrain.

    The greater economic pressure on Iran will also make stability in Iraq of even more importance to them. A stable Iraq becoming their land bridge to the whirled.

  86. .

    An oil embargo is an act of war


    We went through this the other day rat.

    An oil embargo is not an act of war. I would have thought with your facility googling you would have come across this already.


  87. .

    You're behind curve, doug.

    Yeh, about fifty years behind the curve.


  88. That the Iranians have quit funding Hamas, in Gaza, may one reason for the political moderation expressed by those Palestinians, of late.

    If the same can be accomplished in Lebanon, with regards Hezbollah, well, it'd be a "good thing".

  89. It may not be an "act of war" to me, and thee, Q, but that's not what's important.

    Is it an act of war to the Iranians?

  90. Here you go, Q.
    TType 23 Frigate Conducts NATO Embargo Operations Off Libya
    An explanation of real whirled applications and operations during the NATO embargo of Libya.

    If you land troops on a Iranian flagged ship or a Chinese ship that waves you off, on the open sea, you be a pirate, AaaaaRGH!

    Or at war will the flag.

    Who's gonna authorize firing on a Chinese or Iranian tanker to enforce the embargo?

  91. It's so easy to get caught up in the excitement of the "War Drums" that we lose sight of "WHY?"

    Why? What will we accomplish by destroying what's left of the World Ecoomy?

    Will we "Stop" a determined Iran from ever getting a Nuke?

    And, even if we could, would it be "Worth it?"

  92. Kosovo, 1999

    On the opening day of the NATO summit meeting, the alliance agreed today to impose an oil embargo on Serbia and to enforce it by searching ships in the Adriatic Sea suspected of carrying fuel for forces fighting in Kosovo.

    ... By providing ships to conduct searches and inspections, NATO would try to dry up the flow of oil into ports on the coast of Montenegro, which supply Serbia, a Pentagon official said.
    It was not clear what actions NATO might take if ships carrying oil defied the alliance.

  93. I'd have to look up the strict definition of the word, "embargo," but a BLOCKADE is, definitely, 100% an Act of War.

  94. We declared War in 1812 against the British (despite the fact that we didn't even have "warships," if memory serves,) because they were messing with our merchant ships.

  95. Why, is often asked.

    If the Israeli have the intel available, and I would not doubt they do ...

    Then the Iranian nuclear program is right where it was, in 1992.
    Three to five years from completing a nuclear weapon, if they chose to.

    It is now 2012 and the Iranians have not advanced their capabilities, not for twenty years.

    The are still as far from manufacturing a nuclear device as they were in 1992.

    If the public statements and reports from Israeli intelligence sources can be believed. Which I do, the Chief of the Mossad would not lie, in public, about that.

    Why does the lack of advancement towards a weapon, for twenty years, constitute a need for military action, soon?

  96. Thomas Jefferson, and Congress, also declared "War Against Libya, and the Barbary Pirates, for the same reason.

  97. .

    TType 23 Frigate Conducts NATO Embargo Operations Off Libya

    Get your terms straight rat.

    Its obvious you don't know the difference between an embargo and a blockade.

    From Wiki: Embargo

    An embargo is the partial or complete prohibition of commerce and trade with a particular country, in order to isolate it. Embargoes are considered strong diplomatic measures imposed in an effort, by the imposing country, to elicit a given national-interest result from the country on which it is imposed. Embargoes are similar to economic sanctions and are generally considered legal barriers to trade, not to be confused with blockades, which are often considered to be acts of war.[1].

    Iran may consider an embargo to be a causi belli but they can't under the normal interpretation of the word consider it 'an act of war'. If in fact they were to take offensive action in response to an embargo, it would be them starting the war.


  98. Many historians think that our embargo of oil to Japan gave the Japanese military the necessary juice to convince the Emperor, and politicians to approve the attack on Pearl Harbor.

  99. Are We Alone In The Universe?

    Where are they?

    Gone to flowers, every one.

    Picked by young girls....

    Every one


  100. You can force a country into a fight (just as you can a man) without throwing the first punch.

    You've still got a fight; and, it's still you that has caused it.

    So, again; "To What End?"

  101. .

    An embargo is a state-sponsored prohibition on the movement of goods between nations. Embargoes amount to economic warfare and in fact are often used during times of war and hostilities. Embargoes are often employed during peacetime when they prohibit commercial trade with individuals, businesses, or specific countries sans military action or the threat of military action. Embargoes are a legal prohibition on commerce. They may be selective or universal in their prohibition of goods and they may embrace both imports to a country and exports from a country. Regardless of their scope, embargoes are always punitive in nature; their purpose is not to protect home markets (that is what tariffs are for) but rather to punish another country.

    In spite of its punitive nature, an embargo is not a military act of war. An embargo is different from a blockade, which is a military obstruction of commerce by one country against another and can be construed as an act of war...


    While we can argue about the wisdom of applying an embargo or other sanctions we should also consider its legality. The US can legally employ an embargo against Iran without committing an act of war. Whether they should do it, whether there will be any net benefit, another question.

    On the other hand, an embargo can possibly lead to war. Some might define it as 'economic warfare' although the charge would probably not stick in a court of law. But as I recall one of the reasons Japan went to war with the US was that we were depriving them of raw materials.

    However, given the neocon-centricity of OZ, I think we need to identify these actions for what they actually are legally.



  102. In other words, this silent universe is conveying not a flattering lesson about our uniqueness but a tragic story about our destiny. It is telling us that intelligence may be the most cursed faculty in the entire universe — an endowment not just ultimately fatal but, on the scale of cosmic time, nearly instantly so.

    Happy New Year!!!


  103. .

    Sorry, ruf.

    I was funinatin and constructin whilst you were putting up a couple of posts.

    I too remembered the Japanese excuse.

    I may be completely wrong but I would be greatly surprised if Iran is even thinking about closing the Straits. They have admitted that the sanctions to date have hurt them. They are in sore need of money. This is one of the reasons the flow of support to their surrogates throughout the ME has slowed to a trickle. However, by shutting the straights they would be slitting their own throats.

    Not only would they be risking war with much of the world, but they would also be cutting off their only source of income as well as pissing off what few friends they have left including China the biggest importer of their oil.


  104. This comment has been removed by the author.

  105. They fired up shipping in the Straits during the war with Iraq.

  106. Yeah Iran would NEVER mine the Straits

    Operation Praying Mantis was an attack on April 18, 1988, by U.S. naval forces within Iranian territorial waters in retaliation for the Iranian mining of the Persian Gulf during the Iran–Iraq war and the subsequent damage to an American warship.
    On 14 April, the guided missile frigate USS Samuel B. Roberts struck a mine while deployed in the Persian Gulf as part of Operation Earnest Will, the 1987–88 convoy missions in which U.S. warships escorted reflagged Kuwaiti oil tankers to protect them from Iranian attacks. The explosion blew a 25-foot (7.6-meter) hole in the Roberts's hull and nearly sank it. The crew saved their ship with no loss of life, and Roberts was towed to Dubai on 16 April. After the mining, U.S. Navy divers recovered other mines in the area. When the serial numbers were found to match those of mines seized along with the Iran Ajr the previous September, U.S. military officials planned a retaliatory operation against Iranian targets in the Persian Gulf.
    The attack by the U.S. helped pressure Iran to agree to a ceasefire with Iraq later that summer, ending the eight-year conflict between the Persian Gulf neighbors.[2]
    On November 6, 2003, the International Court of Justice ruled that "the actions of the United States of America against Iranian oil platforms on 19 October 1987 (Operation Nimble Archer) and 18 April 1988 (Operation Praying Mantis) cannot be justified as measures necessary to protect the essential security interests of the United States of America." The International court of justice also dismissed Iran's claim that the attack by United States Navy was a breach of the 1955 Treaty of Amity between the two countries.[3]
    This battle was the largest of the five major U.S. surface engagements since the Second World War, which also include the Battle of Chumonchin Chan during the Korean War, the Gulf of Tonkin incident and the Battle of Dong Hoi during the Vietnam War, and the Action in the Gulf of Sidra in 1986. It also marked the U.S. Navy's first exchange of anti-ship missiles by ships.

  107. Many of us were "trying to make a buck" back in the 80's, and probably weren't paying a whole lot of attention to the kerfuffle in the ME between Iraq, and Iran.

    I don't think most of us really remember (or, in my case, never knew) exactly how that whole Persian Gulf "Tanker War" thingie came down.

    Scroll down for Tanker War

  108. .

    We grow justly weary of our politics. But we must remember this: Politics — in all its grubby, grasping, corrupt, contemptible manifestations — is sovereign in human affairs. Everything ultimately rests upon it.

    Fairly or not, politics is the driver of history. It will determine whether we will live long enough to be heard one day. Out there. By them, the few — the only — who got it right.

    What a bright cheery message to start out the new year with, bobbo.

    Next, you'll be revisiting the message of The Star by Arthur C. Clarke where the Star of Bethlehem that announced Christ's birth was actually an exploding supernova in a distant galaxy that wiped out a peaceful, advanced civilization similar in many repects with our own.



  109. Or, 'Rat will be hailing the great contributions by Hussein to our Economy, Energy, and National Security:

    desert rat said...
    You're behind curve, doug.

    1 March 2011

    The Obama administration has given the greenlight for the official resumption of deepwater drilling in the Gulf of Mexico later this month. The government issued the first deepwater drilling permit to a company since the BP oil spill last year.
    Skrebowski says to get the permit, Noble Energy had to prove that it could contain a blowout. It'll be using the same capping technology that finally stopped the BP spill.

    Fri Dec 30, 12:03:00 PM EST

  110. ...in a "reality" where permitting ONE well after a year of stopping ALL drilling in service to his eco-nuts and haters of domestic oil, like our very own (guess who) is hailed as a breakthrough by our Messiah.

  111. Kinda like complimenting him for only costing BOEING 50 billion pluss untold amounts in lost orders in the future.

  112. ...while spouting all the latest mainstream MeMe's bashing Republicans.

    To fulfill the EB's sacred oath to further
    "Balance Balance in Media" tm

  113. IOW

    This place SUCKS

    Big Time

    bunch of self-congratulatory sophomoric maroons

  114. Rufus II said...
    Many of us were "trying to make a buck" back in the 80's, and probably weren't paying a whole lot of attention to the kerfuffle in the ME between Iraq, and Iran.

    I don't think most of us really remember (or, in my case, never knew) exactly how that whole Persian Gulf "Tanker War" thingie came down.

    Scroll down for Tanker War

    Yep thanks for your admitting you don't know jack shit about what you talk about on an hourly basis

  115. GOP Bad

    Ron Paul, Good

    Baloney Bad,
    Shit Sandwich, Good

    etc, ad-nauseum

  116. ot one well, doug.

    Soft ball, aye?

    These pipes, which run nearly two miles deep, are connected to a floating Shell platform that is so remote they named it Perdido, which means "lost" in Spanish. What attracted Shell (RDS.A) to this location is a geologic formation found throughout the Gulf of Mexico that may contain enough oil to satisfy U.S. demand for two years.

    While Perdido is isolated, it isn't alone. Across the Gulf, energy companies are probing dozens of new deepwater fields, thanks to high oil prices and technological advances that finally make it possible to tap them.

    The newfound oil will not do much to lower global oil prices. But together with increased production from onshore U.S. fields and slowing domestic demand for gasoline, it could help reduce U.S. oil imports by more than half over the next decade.

    Eighteen months ago, such a flurry of activity in the Gulf seemed unlikely. The Obama administration halted drilling and stopped issuing new permits after the explosion of a BP well killed 11 workers and caused the largest oil spill in U.S. history.

    But the drilling moratorium was eventually lifted and the Obama administration issued the first new drilling permit in March.
    Now the Gulf is humming again and oil executives describe it as the world's best place to drill.

    "In the short term and the medium term, it's clearly the Gulf of Mexico," says Matthais Bichsel, a Royal Dutch Shell board member who is in charge of all of the company's new projects and technology.

    By early 2012, there will be more rigs in the Gulf designed to drill in its "deep water" — defined as 2,000 feet or deeper — than before the spill.

    A year of downtime, to upgrade the infrastructure, to improve the safety of the workers and the environment, seems fair.

    11 men died when the last "blow out" regulator blew up.

  117. Doug

    You never answered, Doug; What would YOU have done?

    Norway, and, if I'm not mistaken, Even Nigeria requires TWO Sets of Jaws in the Blowout Protector. Not the good ol' USA. They were running wild out there.

    Brazil has just kicked Chevron out of their oil fields for pulling the same shit that BP was pulling. Norway kicked BP out long ago. Shell has fucked up China's Bohai Bay with a monster leak.

    What would YOU have done?

    Would you have let them just keep on "keepin' on?" Doing the same thing?

    Their "Spill Reaction" plans had whole chapters devoted to "Walruses." In the Gulf of Mexico.

    What would YOU have done?

  118. Rufus II said...
    Many historians think that our embargo of oil to Japan gave the Japanese military the necessary juice to convince the Emperor, and politicians to approve the attack on Pearl Harbor.


    Blah, blah, blah:

    Look at a Map of all the countries Japan Occupied PRIOR to our entry into WWII.

    Then add all the countries Germany had already conquered.

    Only a Crazy Ass Paulite would then look for the USA to blame.

    oops, sorry:

    My apologies, Morons.

  119. I don't think I ever claimed to know "jack shit" about the Tanker War.

  120. Are you Drunk, Doug?

    I didn't "blame" the US.

    I was merely showing where Wars had been started because of "embargoes."

  121. I would not have put 30,000 plus out of work as long as possible to service the eco-nuts and EB Crazies.

    I would not have delayed BOEING for one second in service to the Blowjob Unions.

    I would not risk giving the Chicoms the Canadian oil for similar "reasons"

    ...as if Obama can be justified as a rational leader, acting in our best interests.

  122. Yeah, Paul isn't a racist,
    and Paul isn't a blame Amerika

    ...just a sometimes truther that publishes racist rants for decades.

  123. You guys aren't drunk, just deranged.

  124. Correction:
    Rufus is not always drunk,
    just deranged.

  125. Those pipeline jobs are temporary jobs, Doug. And they'll still be there in a few months, or a year, when they finally start building it.

  126. Besides, Doug, you don't even understand what that pipeline is all about. That Pipeline is to take the oil, now pay attention to this, To. The. Sea.

    Instead of going to Cushing, it will go to refineries in Houston, and Port Arthur.

    There, now pay even more attention to this, it will be Sold. To. The. Highest. Bidder. (the highest bidder could be a blender in Des Moines, or a Refinery in Bangkok. It Does Not Matter To The Seller.)

    If that oil goes to Vancouver, it will Also, pay attention, Be. Sold. To. The. Highest. Bidder. (That bidder, likewise, could be in San Diego, or Shanghai.)

  127. Mind you, there is no evidence that the rigs being prevented from operating are anything but safe.


    While the BP Deepwater Horizon oil spill and the Obama administration's subsequent six-month moratorium on deep-water drilling in the Gulf of Mexico are common knowledge, the fact that the federal government has turned the tragic accident into an ongoing economic calamity seems to be drawing scant attention.

    Though the drilling moratorium was officially lifted three months ago, it has been replaced with an ongoing de facto ban. But the full scope and damaging consequences of the federal government's reactions to the gulf spill go well beyond deep-water drilling.

    While the moratorium was limited to deep-water rigs, the work stoppage in the Gulf was not. Due to new regulations and ever-evolving permit processes, many shallow-water oil and gas drilling operations have been effectively shut down as well.
    Mind you, there is no evidence that the rigs being prevented from operating are anything but safe.

    During the six-month hiatus, though most companies decided to ride out the situation (believing the work stoppage was for a fixed period of time), no fewer than five of the 33 deep-water rigs in operation at the time of the spill moved to foreign shores to fulfill their intended purpose.

    Now rig owners, the contractors who lease them, and tens of thousands of workers find themselves subject to an indefinite waiting game as the federal bureaucracy mills about. As rigs continue to sit idle, pressure is mounting for contractors to void existing leases, and an increasing number of jobs are under threat.


    Larsen always chaffed at that, having first-hand experience at the rather stellar safety record the conventional drillers had achieved.

    ...for decades

  128. Seems that I recall that the Bush admin had set into the sop of how to contain a gulf oil issue?

    Yep ole Bush had set it up within the Coast Guard rule book that all wells would NOT be put out, rather allow to burn off.

    What Obama did, by leading from behind, was allow a patch work of people doing the best they could to put out the fire....

    Did Fireboats Sink the Oil Rig?
    Some clues from a maritime disaster in February 1942.
    By Bryce Hall|Posted Thursday, May 6, 2010, at 6:57 PM ET

    Here's what we know for sure about the disaster in the Gulf of Mexico: On April 20, the Deepwater Horizon oil rig exploded, killing 11 people onboard; 36 hours later, it sank into the ocean. Investigations are under way to determine the cause of the accident and how it might have been prevented. So far, these have focused on what caused the explosion in the first place (was it a bad cementing job by Halliburton?) and what caused a blowout preventer safety device to fail. But it may be just as important to figure out why the oil rig capsized and sank beneath the waves. This latter event may have turned a manageable disaster into a full-scale catastrophe.
    In the first hours after the explosion, most of the spilled oil was burning off in the fire, and the initial damage estimates were small. But when the Deepwater Horizon turned over on its 400-foot pontoons, the mile-long pipe that connected it to the underwater wellhead collapsed like a mess of spaghetti. Now the oil is leaking from this jumbled steel on the ocean floor at two sites where the pipe buckled and broke. If the first rescue crews on the scene had somehow been able to prevent the rig from sinking, they might have disconnected the pipe safely and capped it near the surface.

    Thereby sinking the platform of course and breaking the well head off.

    Better to have stayed the course with what Bush had made law...

    But no....

    Cause a greater disaster by lack of leadership on the front end.

  129. You will defend your points no matter how ridiculous you have to get in your arguments:

    Like the tens of thousands of jobs that would be lost if your hero Hussein succeeds in losing the evil pipeline.

    To please the know nothing psychos who equate domestic oil with the devil.

  130. As I've said, doug, I support Gar Johnson. Once the two term Governor of New Mexico.

    He's "my" candidate. Frozen out by GOP elites from the Primary process.
    He hadn't "raised" enough money, amongst one of the "qualifiers" to participate.

    Regardless, only Doctor echoes my foreign policy position. Foreign policy is the premier Presidential power, so supporting the candidate that supports my position strengthens it.

    Up to 25% of interested Republicans in Iowa now are supporting a candidate that campaigns to:

    "Bring the Boys Home!"

    Which I've advocated for years.
    I won't support those that want to expand US military interventionism.
    None is best
    Small is better than larger.

    The economic tools have just begun, give 'em time to work their magic.

    There is a three to five year window. The Mossad has told US so.

  131. Under Bush, the female employees of the USGS seemed to be primarily tasked with giving poontang, and blowjobs to oil company Execs.

    It turns out, nobody was out there checking the Logs, and they were just winging it.

    Basically, the same bunch that have had pipelines leaking all over the country the last year (including into the Yellowstone River,) and wanted to build a pipeline across (basicall "IN") the part of the Ogallala that's only inches from the surface.

  132. If the electorate had wanted the continuation of Bush regulatory policies and stay the course decision making, well, Mr McCain would have won the election of 2008.

  133. "Basically, the same bunch that have had pipelines leaking all over the country the last year "

    It sure is too damned bad they allowed any of them evil pipes to be built.

    We'd be so much better off w/o any of them.

    Sig Heil, Hussein

  134. Doug, I don't know a lot about pipelines, but you don't know jack.

    Some of that oil (actually, it's bitumin, not oil) is going west, regardless. And, it'll be American workers that build the pipeline that takes it there.

  135. Brilliant analysis, 'Rat.
    Simply brilliant.

  136. The real reason McCain was not elected was that Laura Bush's Guns were not as buff as Michele's.
    ...our Belle

  137. Doug, your hatred of Obama has warped your thinking. That pipeline across the Yellowstone, like so many, is very old, and hasn't been "maintained" well.

    Pipelines are "eeevil." But, if you don't Force the oil companies to maintain them, they will end up rusting in place. That is not Opinion. That is "Observed Fact."

  138. Should have been: pipeline "Aren't" eeevil.

  139. Yep them Refineries are 100 percent run by robots.

    ...and I notice no defense of Hussein's shutdown of BOEING's SOLAR plant has yet been made.

  140. ...I grew up amongst oil workers, fwiw.

    Not more devilish than your average joe and jane, imo.

  141. The fact that Mr Bush and Company were "Blindsided" by economic meltdown, it just goes to exemplify that all their economic policies were suspect.

    Then the Halliburton/BP blow out exemplified another Bush Administration failure, Mr Obama "Blindsided" by the outcomes of holdover bureaucratic policies and previous decisions.

  142. I guess that's because it was never shut down.

    It opened, ahead of schedule, I think, and it producing planes as we speak.

    The lawsuit has been dropped.

    Yes, I strongly disagree with what the NLRB did in the Boeing case, but for the life of me, I can't figure out what in the hell that has to do with anything that's been discussed on this thread, today.

    I, also, strongly disagree with, basically, everything Holder has done, but, again, it has nothing to do with anything discussed today.

  143. Tell me, doug. if you in Iowa, at the upcoming caucus, just who is you'd be for?

  144. It was dropped when the Unions got their pound of flesh out of Boeing.

    ...as if decisions made for non-business reasons are good for business.

  145. Anybody but Paul

    In the General?

    Anybody but Obama

    Them's the choices

  146. Doug's got those choices exactly right.


  147. I've never belonged to a Union in my life, Doug; but I'd hate to live in a country where they were outlawed.

  148. The crapper, who has supported Ron Paul for years, is now slithering out from under and heading to Johnson, since Paul has recently been shown for all to see as nothing but a steaming pile of lying paranoid thoughtless pieces of shit.


  149. No slithering.

    Ron Paul has broken trail for years.
    The National Headliner for auditing the Federal Reserve and to bring our troops home.

    He supports a limited government.
    A less intrusive Federal government.

    He has brought organization and greater popularization of the governing philosophy I support.

    Three cheers for that!

    I do know, by search the RCP data base that in the southern primaries of 2008, Mr Romney never performed better than 20%, across the Republican south and that was in Florida.
    He didn't even bother going to Texas.

    If he is the "Best" the GOP has, they're gonna lose.

    As I said earlier, the GOP is at a decision point, nominate a transitional candidate, like Barry Goldwater or go with the Bob Dole paradigm.

    They've savaged Gingrich, and besides, he's not focused enough to get on the VA ballot.

    Leaving them with a Bob Dole clone, it's his turn after all, "Wall Street" Romney.

    I'd rather support the politico that calls for military withdrawal from Europe, Okinawa and Korea.

  150. Better to support the policies you support than "Anyone but".

    Stand for something
    Or you'll fall for anything.

    Proven cultural truth.

  151. Rufus and rat learning ya Doug?
    Talk to em real nice and they'll hook u up with an Obama 12 bumper sticker.
    hope and change and all that

  152. There's no bumper sticker.

    Just the realities that the whirled, it has not ended.

    The empty rhetoric, is just that, empty.

  153. I just so happy you impart all that brilliance and bellicosity for free.
    Although Doug doesn't seemed swayed by your Obama advocacy.

  154. It's not Obama advocacy, it's relating reality.

    The Gulf deep water drilling operations not "Stopped", as doug told us it was.

    The permitting process has not been limited to ONE rig, as doug told us it was.

    Deep water drilling is, according to USA Today, at levels equivalent to those prior to the Halliburton/BP blow out.

    doug and anoni are now arguing whether these levels could have been achieved quicker, utilizing Bush era regulations.

    The same regulations that led to the environment that allowed operations like the Halliburton/BP blow out to occur.

    With great loss of life, not a common industrial accident. Not at all.

    That Team Obama did their due diligence, a good thing, as Mr Obama is now responsible for the infrastructure and process.

  155. Will Mr Romney return to Bush era safety and permitting standards, or will he now "Stay the Course"?

    What is the GOP platform stance on worker and environmental safety on these deep water rigs?

  156. So, Rufus. Any of your stalwart union member cousins work at the Orion Township Chevy assembly plant?

    Those new Chevy Sonics are unstoppable, it seems.

  157. Another model car I'd never heard of.

    American made

    Michigan, anyway.

    Think they'll transfer production to Mexico, where they still have non-Union standards?

    With Sonic, G.M. Stands Automaking on Its Head

    The production line has been squeezed into half the space of a traditional plant. Welding robots are concentrated in efficient clusters, instead of being spaced along the line, while many of the workers earn half the typical union wage. Even the first coat of rust-proofing has been reformulated so that it is one-hundredth as thick as — and thereby cheaper than — the coating on other cars.

    The Sonic is also expected to be a breakthrough in establishing a new level of cooperation between Detroit and the United Automobile Workers.

    The radically revamped factory here operates with fewer and cheaper workers, many of whom are paid $14 an hour rather than the full U.A.W. wage of $28 an hour.

    The plant itself is smaller and reconfigured to save money, with company executives modeling some of the changes after G.M.’s most efficient factories in Germany and Korea. The production line’s footprint alone was reduced from a million square feet to 500,000 — the equivalent of losing the space of more than two Wal-Mart Super Stores. The energy bill was cut by powering some operations with methane gas from neighboring landfills.

    The Sonic will be G.M.’s littlest, and most fuel-efficient, conventionally powered vehicle. It was conceived in 2008 before the federal government’s bailout of the bankrupt automaker, when negotiators from the company and the union began brainstorming about what it would take to make a profitable subcompact car in the United States rather than in low-wage countries.

    “We wanted to prove we could do it,” said Diana D. Tremblay, G.M.’s head of global manufacturing.

    The U.A.W. tried to persuade the Ford Motor Company to build the Fiesta subcompact in the United States. But Ford chose a plant in Mexico

    The NYTimes

  158. Ron Paul abiding by the Constitution is "dangerous” according to Rick Santorum. Come on, but the best comes from the Michele Bachman camp:

    "I've been serving as Michele Bachmann's State Chair over the last year. And while Michele has fought tremendously for my conservative values, I believe we're at a turning point in this campaign," said Iowa State Senator Kent Sorenson Wednesday night...

    Hours after standing at Bachmann's side, Sorenson voiced his support for republican rival Ron Paul.

    "He was with me at our campaign stop in Indianola. He told me he was on board, and then he got in his car and he went and announced he was going with the Ron Paul campaign," said Bachmann.”

    The media refuse to acknowledge that a large portion of Paul's popularity, especially among independents and members of the military, actually results from his views on foreign policy -- not good news for the neocons.

  159. Rat said "call their bluff". That implies you are ready to go to war over the issue rat. Hardly a small footprint approach.

  160. War?
    Please ash.
    Get with the jargon.
    It's responsibility to protect.

    Responsibility to protect -
    Strait of Hormuz

  161. Ancient Chinese secret

  162. This comment has been removed by the author.

  163. No, ash, it does NOT mean war.

    It means we line up the Chinese to step in, at discount prices.

    The international/national banking system of the whirled well beyond the US news cycle to comprehend, they'd never get it explained to the mud hut crowd.

    The Iranians have to be offered a way out, we provide for Charlie to offer them one.

    Everyone wins, but the Iranians.
    But their cost/benefit analysis will force them to the table, with Charlie.

    Within three to five years the faction headed by Ali Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani will be in charge, and they'll moderate.

    Or not, but that'll be in three to five years.

  164. It would be an error to become actively involved on the ground in Syria.

    That's what the Turks and Kurdish proxies are for.

    If the Turks do not step up, we fund the Kurds to. They have a population in Syria to build a local insurgency around.

    But to directly assist the Muslim Brotherhood, to take charge of Syria, a definite error in strategic planning.

  165. Worse than installing the Shia in Baghdad.

  166. But U.S. officials said that they are moving cautiously in order to avoid destabilizing Syria further, and to make sure they know as much as possible about the country's complex dynamics before getting more involved.

  167. They want to know "as much as possible" before getting involved?


    I never heard of such a thing.

    You can tell they're not neocons.

    Probly didn't even go to Yale.

    Much less become "Boners."

  168. thought deuce put up some info while back that forces already active in Syria.

    Maybe already involved

  169. Do not recall that.

    But ...

    Qatar Creates 20000 strong Anti-Syria Mercenary Force based in Turkey, Israeli Media Reports.

    Damascus /NationalTurk – Qatar finances and arms radical intervention force based in Turkey to activate it in Syria with the purpose to defeat the government of Tyrant president Bashar al-Assad reports the Israeli website DEBKAFile.

    According to this report, which Cham Press Agency echoes today, that paid contingency made of mercenaries from several countries of the region plus radical Syrian from Muslim Brotherhood had named it Syrian Army of Liberation, DEBKAFile says
    A dispatch from Syrian SANA news agency taken from the authorities’ declarations of the northern province informed they seized the group a great quantity of weapons, military uniforms and modern communication devices.

    The information from the Israeli media adds that Qatar decided to boost a plan after the defeat and dead of the Libyan leader Muammar El Gaddafi as the mercenary army took part in raids in Libya to support the demise of Muammar Gaddafi.

  170. Here, time for a smile. Hear about the man arrested for "having more pussy than he could handle"

    really :)

    Best local news bloopers

  171. Our proxies ARE on the move
    As reported in the Daily Star, out of Lebanon ...

    “The traditional power structure is breaking down. We are now seeing many alliances on different issues, but as most traditional powers are witnessing various types of transitions, a new phenomenon is emerging. We are seeing independently minded states such as Qatar and Turkey playing a much bigger role,” said Salman Shaikh, director of Brookings Doha Center in Qatar.

    “Qatar is allied to the United States but pursues an independent policy,”
    Shaikh explained, citing the example of Qatar’s relations with Palestinian Islamist group Hamas, as well as its general position on the Palestinian issue. “Similarly, Turkey is a NATO member, but it also has its independent policy on many issues, particularly on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and its relations with Muslim Brotherhood groups,” he added.

    Shaikh said that the increasing bond between GCC countries, mainly the alliance between Saudi Arabia and Qatar, is probably the only clear coalition that has so far emerged from the Arab Spring.

    Read more: http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2011/Dec-28/158105-arab-spring-shakes-up-regional-power-balance.ashx#ixzz1i4W067A0
    (The Daily Star :: Lebanon News :: http://www.dailystar.com.lb)

    Team Obama playing all the "right" cords.

  172. Qatar, Turkey and Saudi Arabia.

    Our allies and proxies are taking the lead, as they should.

    Hip Hip Hooray!

  173. The US, as I used to say quite a bit, is allied with the Islamoids.

    Some of the Islamoids, anyway.

  174. .

    So what's up?

    Doug off his meds again?


  175. rat, that would require giving the Chinese an exemption from the US legislation. Are you seriously proposing that as an option??? I think you are blowing smoke and don't have the faintest clue what you are talking about.

  176. When is that not the case, Ash?

  177. Not at all, ash.

    From that esteemed publication
    "Foreign Policy"

    Who;s Sanctioning Whom?

    while an amendment to the 2012 U.S. defense authorization bill would try to close down transactions with Iran's Central Bank. China's leading refiner, Sinopec, halved its January purchases of Iranian crude on a dispute over credit terms, while Saudi supplies surged by a third.

    This is exactly the intention of the amendment:
    to narrow the circle of Iran's customers to China and a few others, giving them the ability to extract discounts and thus starving the Islamic Republic of revenue.
    But most likely, oil sanctions would fail, and a great deal of diplomatic capital will have been expended to no avail. Japan and South Korea, for instance, both rely on Iran for 10 percent of their crude imports, and waived oil sanctions. Turkey renewed its long-standing crude contract last Wednesday. And despite its incompetent response so far, Iran should be able to find ways round tightened oil sanctions -- barter trade, for example, or smuggling via Iraq and Pakistan -- with the assistance of ingenious sanctions-busters lured by lucrative deals. What it loses in discounts to China is largely made up by the higher prices these geopolitical tensions bring.

    "Foreign Policy" mentions it twice, so far.

  178. The Foreign Policy piece goes on ...

    In the United States' interminable confrontation with Iran, a country with 2 percent of its GDP and 1.5 percent of its military budget, it is handing gifts to two real rivals: China and Russia.
    China benefits, as noted, from discounts on its oil purchases. If the Central Bank sanctions work as intended, a China hooked on cheap Iranian oil is hardly going to work for any resolution to the standoff.
    Veterans of the Iran-Iraq war, the Iranian hard-liners have seen their country survive even tougher times than today, and emerge, in their view, with revolutionary fervor strengthened. For them to bow to sanctions by making significant concessions on the nuclear issue would be political suicide.

  179. Now, perhaps the "Foreign Policy" folks a true believers, like those at the "Christian Science Monitor"?

    Now the folks at Al Jazeera may be biased, but they report a similar story

    State department spokesperson Victoria Nuland said Thursday that the US was studying how to apply sanctions against Iran's Central Bank "while causing minimum disruption” for its allies. But she did not explain how that's possible when enforcement requires a US financial ban on anyone who does business with it.

    And while Asian allies like Japan are scrambling for ways to cope with the US-led initiatives, China and Russia are looking forward to exploiting them.

  180. From Russia's they report ...

    The current round of Iran’s sanctions is focusing on oil exports.
    So far, China has completely ignored the oil sanctions on Iran and is increasing its import of Iranian oil.
    India also imports oil from Iran, and has had well documented troubles actually settling the oil transactions. Pressure from the US government on India has meant that third party countries have had to step in and settle the multibillion dollar trade account India has had with Iran. Recently, Pakistan has brushed off threats of sanctions against them from the US for perusing a gas pipeline from Iran to Pakistan. Pakistan needs the gas to grow its economy, and Iran’s gas is a natural choice. It should be noted that both Iran and Pakistan are members of ECO (Economic Co-operation Organisation)
    Sanctions create mispricing in Energy markets. Sanctions on Iran’s oil means Europe would have an energy crisis, the G8 countries, most of which are heavily in debt and have no oil, would be paying more for oil while China and India would be buying Iranian oil at a discount.
    Only intellectually lazy people could possible think this is a good result.

  181. So let;s see, now.

    Foreign Policy
    Al Jeezera
    Ria Novosti

    They all carry the same story line.
    Someone, somewhere, must believe it.

    I could find more, if you think it required, ash.

  182. From within Iran we can find, from Fars News Agency ...

    A large number of Chinese, Indian and other Asian firms have negotiated or signed up to oil and gas deals with Iran.

    On Friday, Indian Ambassador to Tehran D.P. Srivastava dismissed the US-led sanctions on trade with Iran, and underlined New Delhi's enthusiasm for boosting its oil imports from the Middle-Eastern country.

    "We want an increase in Iran's oil exports to India," Srivastava said in a meeting with the governor-general of Iran's Southern Hormozgan province Friday night.

  183. The Council on Foreign Relations reports ...

    U.S. officials say it is unclear whether these sanctions would affect Iran's exports to China, its biggest buyer of oil. David Cohen, the Treasury Department's undersecretary for terrorism and financial intelligence, told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee last week that
    "it is quite possible that the Chinese, if this amendment were adopted, would take the risk essentially that we would cut off their financial institutions from the United States but I am just not in a position to predict exactly how the Chinese would react."

    Mark Katz of George Mason University says,
    "Western sanctions have contributed to a dramatic increase in Iranian trade with--and economic dependence on--China."

    How dependent is the US upon Chinese financial services and the credit line the US has, there?

  184. Go North, Young Man

    All we got to do is watch what Canada is doing, and do the same.


  185. It would seem, to me, that there is more than a "clue" in that reading, amigo.

    There are all the dots a fella needs to connect, to see the real picture.

    The Europeons get kicked in the head, Italy, Greece and Spain, the "Strongmen of Europe" take it in the shorts.

    The Chinese sail on, sailor.

  186. Now you support CanadaCare, for the US, boobie?

    Golly, they've been doing that for decades, in Canada. Now you want to replicate it, here in the US.

  187. The legislation allows Mr Obama to waive the Banking restrictions, with a national security finding.

    Think China would get one, or do we mint those platinum coins?

  188. Poor anoni, never gets it right.

    Always sniping, and missing the mark.

    Wonder what that must feel like, to be made a fool of, time and again.

    Guess it'd make a fella stop using his sign-on and become an anoni, just out of the sheer embarrassment.

  189. Now whether Mr Obama would have to issue a "blanket" waiver, or coul do so on a country by country basis is not reported.

    It is in Time Magazine that it is reported:

    The bill allows President Obama to waive implementation where U.S. national security is affected, although on the time-lines in the current version, he would have to issue three such waivers before election day to prevent a de facto oil embargo on Iran going into effect.

    Read more: http://globalspin.blogs.time.com/2011/12/11/tighter-sanctions-on-iran-an-alternative-to-war-or-a-road-to-war/#ixzz1i5aXTUcu

  190. So, yeah, the US could well be able to exempt China from the central bank restrictions.

    Seems like that would be possible, one way or another.

  191. Kinda had my tongue in my cheek there, crapper, but you didn't get it.