“This site is dedicated to preying on peoples vanity, ignorance, or loneliness, gaining their trust and betraying them without remorse.”

Wednesday, March 19, 2014

“Organs looted from our sons”


Organ Gangs Force Poor to Sell Kidneys for Desperate Israelis

‘Exploit Shortages’ 

“There have been successes fighting organ trafficking around the world,” Delmonico says.  
“But organ trafficking continues to flourish because criminals exploit shortages of organ donors.”

Bloomberg Markets reported in June that U.S. citizens and others from the Americas suffering from kidney failure were going to Nicaragua and Peru to buy organs in a shadowy trade that injured and killed donors and recipients. 

That U.S.-Latin American connection is dwarfed by a network of organ-trafficking organizations whose reach extends from former Soviet Republics such as Azerbaijan, Belarus and Moldova to Brazil, the Philippines, South Africa and beyond, a Bloomberg Markets investigation shows.

Many of the black-market kidneys harvested by these gangs are destined for people who live in Israel.

Not Enough Donors 

With a generally well-educated population of 7.4 million and a modern medical system, Israel has an acute shortage of organs, in part because of religious beliefs. Just 12 percent of Israelis are registered donors, meaning they have consented to let their organs be used for transplants after they die, according to the Israeli National Transplant Center.

That compares with 40 percent of Americans. About 730 Israelis are currently waiting for a transplant, which is 13 times more than the number of such surgeries performed legally in Israel in 2010, according to the center. 

Delmonico, a professor of surgery at Harvard Medical School, has spent the past six years lobbying governments and doctors around the world to combat organ trafficking. ...

The dearth of available organs in Israel has spawned a new class of criminals, mainly immigrants from the former Soviet Union, says Jerusalem Police Superintendent Gilad Bahat.


Investigators on five continents say they have uncovered intertwining criminal rings run by Israelis and eastern Europeans that move people across borders -- sometimes against their will -- to sell a kidney.

“The criminal here is the middleman who profits from the sick and the poor,” says Bahat, who investigated an organ- trafficking ring in Jerusalem. “It touches my heart that people will sell part of their body because they need money to live.”

‘Obscene Profit’
Criminals see an opportunity to make big money in the organ trade, where they can sell a kidney for 15 to 20 times what they pay, police throughout Europe say.

“They recognize the obscene profit that can be made in the expanding black market in body parts,”
says Jonathan Ratel, a Pristina, Kosovo-based prosecutor who has been investigating organ trafficking over the past two years. “It keeps happening because there is so much money in this.” 

Traffickers typically pay $10,000 to a seller for a kidney and collect $150,000 when selling it to a patient.

Traffickers prey on the most-vulnerable people. Moldova, the poorest country in Europe, is one of their prime hunting grounds.


Dorin Razlog, a shepherd with an eighth-grade education who lives in Ghincauti, says recruiters for a trafficking ring told him cash for a kidney would lift him out of poverty. After doctors in Istanbul cut out the organ in August 2002, they paid him $7,000 -- $3,000 less than they’d offered. Of that, $2,500 was in counterfeit bills, he says. 
 
Prosecutors in nine countries have been conducting criminal probes of organ trafficking involving Israeli patients since 2003. The largest case dates to that year, when the Brazilian Federal Police noticed people from two slums of Recife, a coastal city 2,110 kilometers (1,311 miles) from Sao Paulo, flying to Durban, South Africa.

They returned home in so much pain from incisions across their abdomens that they needed assistance to get off the plane, says Karla Gomes de Matos Maia, the investigator who led the probe.

‘Suspect Organ Trafficking’

“Here you had people who didn’t fit the profile of tourists going to a strange destination and coming back after having major surgery,” Maia says. “We began to suspect organ trafficking.”

The Brazilian case is still wending its way through international courts. In November 2010 in Durban, Netcare Ltd. (NTC) -- South Africa’s largest hospital company -- pleaded guilty to violating the Human Tissue Act, which prohibits buying and selling organs.


Netcare paid 7.8 million rand ($848,464) in fines and penalties. It admitted to allowing 92 transplants in which donors from Brazil, Israel and Romania sold kidneys to Israeli patients. Four doctors are awaiting trial on trafficking charges.


* * * * * * * *

Palestinians accuse the Israeli army of selling the organs of its victims
Donald Boström

Israel has admitted that in the 1990s, its forensic pathologists harvested organs from dead bodies, including Palestinians, without permission of their families.

The issue emerged with publication of an interview with the 
then-head of Israel's Abu Kabir forensic institute, Dr. Jehuda Hiss.

Doctor Jehuda Hiss
The interview was conducted in 2000 by an American academic, who released it because of a huge controversy last summer over an allegation by a Swedish newspaper that Israel was killing Palestinians in order to harvest their organs. Israel hotly denied the charge.

Parts of the interview were broadcast on Israel's Channel 2 TV over the weekend. In it, Hiss said, 
"We started to harvest corneas ... Whatever was done was highly informal.
 No permission was asked from the family."


The Channel 2 report said that in the 1990s, forensic specialists at Abu Kabir harvested skin, corneas, heart valves and bones from the bodies of Israeli soldiers, Israeli citizens, Palestinians and foreign workers, often without permission from relatives.

In a response to the TV report, the Israeli military confirmed that the practice took place.

August, 17, 2009  
"I am what you can call a 'matchmaker'”, said Levy Izhak Rosenbaum from Brooklyn, USA, in a secret recording by an FBI-agent whom he believed to be a client. Ten days later, at the end of July this year, Rosenbaum was arrested in connection with a massive corruption ring uncovered in New Jersey: rabbis, congressmen and entrusted officials had for years been busy with money laundering and the illegal organ trade, which now ended up like a Sopranos episode.  Rosenbaum’s matchmaking had nothing to do with romance and everything to do with buying and selling, on the black market,  kidneys from Israel. According to his own statements, he buys organs from poor people in Israel for $10,000 and sells them back to desperate patients in the US for $160,000. ...  

Levy Izhak Rosenbaum is driven away by FBI agents.
Rosenbaum was allegedly a middleman in the illegal organ trade.
 Photo: AP
The accusations have shaken the American transplant industry. Should this be true,  it would be the first time organ trafficking has been documented in the US, according to experts cited by the newspaper New Jersey Real-Time News.
On the question of how many organs were sold, Rosenbaum says: "Quite a lot." And he boasts, "I have never failed." His business was carried out over a very long period of time.

Francis Delmonici, a professor in transplant surgery at Harvard, and member of the Board at the National Kidney Foundation’s Board of Directors, is quoted in the same newspaper, saying that the same type of organ trafficking which takes place in Israel, also takes place in other parts of the world. Delmonici says that of the 63,000 kidney transplants in the world, approximately 10% are illegal.

Hot countries for that type of illegal trade are Pakistan, the Philippines and China, where it is believed that organs are taken from executed prisoners. But strong suspicion also exists in Palestine, where people believe that their young men, captured as prisoners, have, as in China and Pakistan, been taken as organ donors and that they were later executed. This is a very serious allegation that raises so many questions, that the ICJ, International Court of Justice, should absolutely open an investigation over the possibility of war crimes perpetrated by Israel.

Israel has time and again been at the forefront of criticism when it comes to its unethical way of handling organs and transplants. Countries like France have suspended their  cooperation on organs with Israel since the beginning of the 90s, and the Jerusalem Post wrote: 
 ”Other countries in Europe are expected to follow France’s example shortly”.


Half of the new kidneys that Israelis have received since the beginning of the year 2000 have been illegally bought from Turkey, Eastern Europe or South America. The Israeli health-care authorities have a complete knowledge of the activity, but do nothing to stop it. In 2003, at a conference, it was revealed that Israel is the only western country where doctors do not condemn the illegal trade of organs or take any legal measures against doctors who have conducted such illegal operations. To the contrary, according to Dagens Nyheter (December 5, 2003), the Chief Doctors of the largest hospitals are involved in the majority of illegal transplant cases, .

Ehud Olmert
In an attempt to fill the need for organs in the country, Israel’s then health minister, Ehud Olmert, ordered a large campaign in the summer of 1992, to get the Israeli population to come forward as organ donors. One half million pamphlets were distributed to local newspapers where citizens were encouraged to write to donate their organs after their death. Ehud Olmert was the first to write his name down.

Only a couple of weeks later, the Jerusalem Post wrote that the campaign had been very successful. Not less than 35 000 persons had enrolled, when usually it’s about 500 a month. In the same article, the journalist Judy Siegel, wrote that the gap between offer and demand was still extensive. 500 persons were queuing for a kidney transplant, but only 124 could receive surgery.
 Out of 45 persons in need of a new liver, only three had a chance to get an operation in Israel.

At the same time when that campaign was going on, 
young Palestinians were disappearing and were being returned at night to their villages, 
five days later, dead and ripped up.

The story of the ripped up bodies terrified the populations in Gaza and the West Bank. There was a story of a dramatic increase of young men’s disappearance, with the subsequent nightly funerals of autopsied young men.

Donald Boström
I was in the area working on a book when I was contacted several times by UN staff members who were worried about the situation. Those who contacted me said that the theft of organs indeed took place, but that there was nothing they could do. On assignment for a TV company, I traveled around and spoke with a great number of Palestinian families in the West Bank and Gaza, who declared that their sons had been robbed of their organs before they were killed. One of the examples I came across on that gruesome journey was the young stone thrower Bilal Achmed Ghanan.

It was close to midnight when the sound of the engines of cars coming from the Israeli military column was heard in the outskirts of the small village called Imatin on the northern part of the West Bank. The two thousand villagers were awake and stood silently, shadowed in the dark. Some were posted on the roofs, others behind their curtains, houses or trees that could give them protection in the darkness under the curfew but could give them a good view over what would become the cemetery for the village’s first martyr. The military had cut off all electrical power around the village and the area was restricted to the military — not a single cat could move outside without risking its life. The darkness’ numbing silence was only broken by quiet sobbing, and I don’t remember if we were shivering because of the cold or because of the suspense. Five days earlier, on May 13th, 1992, an Israeli special force unit had waited in an ambush at the village’s carpentry shop. The person the special forces were looking for was the young 19-year old Bilal Achmed Ghanan, whom they had orders to neutralize, as he was one those active young Palestinians who rendered the Israeli occupation forces’ lives miserable by throwing stones.

Bilal Ghanan was one of the leading stone throwers and had been on the wanted list for a couple of years. This meant that he and other wanted stone throwing boys lived under the bare sky up in the Nablus Mountains. To be captured implied death and all the stories about previous torture scenes did not improve things. So they remained in the mountains. But for one reason or another, Bilal came down from the mountains one day and wandered unprotected into the village, passing the carpenter’s house on that unlucky day in mid-May. Why he did come down on that particular day, not even Talal, his older brother, could say. Perhaps there was a lack of food and they were short of supplies.


Everything happened according to plans for the Israeli Special Forces unit. They stubbed out their cigarettes, took away the cans of Coca Cola and took aim calmly and quietly through the broken window. When Bilal was near enough, they only had to squeeze the trigger. He got shot the first time in the chest. According to the villagers who witnessed the incident, he was also shot after that, once in each leg. After which, two soldiers ran out from the carpentry shop and shot him twice in the stomach. Finally, they took Bilal by the feet and dragged him down the 20 steps of stone of the carpentry. The villagers also say that afterwards, people from the UN and the Red Crescent who happened to be in the area and had heard the shots came to take care of the wounded.

The discussion over who would take care of the victim ended when the Israeli forces took charge of the badly hurt Bilal, loaded him into a jeep and drove away to the village’s outskirts. There waited a military helicopter that took Bilal away to an unknown destination.

Five days later, he was back in the darkness, dead and wrapped up in green hospital cloths. When the military column, that had come to get Bilal from the autopsy center Abu Kabir outside Tel Aviv, stopped by the place where Bilal would be placed to rest, someone recognized the Israeli military leader by the name of Captain Yahya. In the dark, a person whispered “The worst of them all” in my ear. After Captain Yahya’s men had unloaded the body and exchanged the green cloth for a light colored cotton cloth, a few male relatives were picked up to complete the job by digging earth and mixing cement.

Together with the sharp sound of the spades, some laughs were heard on the part of the soldiers who waited to go home as they exchanged jokes with each other. When Bilal was lowered down to the ground, his chest was exposed and it became suddenly clear to those who were present what type of abuse he had been subjected to. Bilal was by no means the first person who was buried with a stitched up body from the stomach to the neck, but speculation about the purpose jumpstarted.

Bilal Achmed Ghanan, 19 years old, was shot and taken by Israeli soldiers. 
His body was later returned stitched up again from belly to neck. Photo: Donald Boström 
The victimized Palestinian families on the West Bank and Gaza were convinced of what had happened to their sons. "Our sons are used as unwilling organ donors," said the relatives of Khaled from Nablus to me. The same went with Raed from Jenin and the cousins to Machmod and Nafes from Gaza, who all disappeared over a number of days and had returned at night, dead and autopsied.

Bilal Achmed Ghanem was one of the 133 Palestinians who were killed in various ways that year. According to Palestinian statistics, the reasons of death were as follows:   shot in the street, explosion, battery, tear gas, intentionally run over by a car, hanged in prison, shot at school, killed in the house, etc. Of those 133 assassinated persons of all ages from four months to 88 years old, 69 were autopsied, which is to say half of the dead. The routine autopsies carried out on dead Palestinians, as the army spokesman said, do not match  the reality in the occupied areas. The questions remain.

We know that there is a great need for organs in Israel. And we know that there is a widespread illegal organ trade under way, that it has been going on for a long time, that it takes place with the blessing of the authorities, and that high-level doctors in the largest hospitals and officials at different levels also take part in it. And we know that Palestinian young men disappeared, that they were returned five days later under mysterious circumstances at night, ripped up and stitched back.

* * * * * * * *
 
Israeli Organ Harvesting
by ALISON WEIR

In the article, “Our sons plundered for their organs,” veteran journalist Donald Bostrom writes that Palestinians “harbor strong suspicions against Israel for seizing young men and having them serve as the country’s organ reserve – a very serious accusation, with enough question marks to motivate the International Court of Justice (ICJ) to start an investigation about possible war crimes.”

An army of Israeli officials and apologists immediately went into high gear, calling both Bostrom and the newspaper’s editors “anti-Semitic.” The Israeli foreign minister was reportedly “aghast” and termed it “a demonizing piece of blood libel.” An Israeli official called it “hate porn.”

The fact is, however, that substantiated evidence of public and private organ trafficking and theft, and allegations of worse, have been widely reported for many years. Given such context, the Swedish charges become far more plausible than might otherwise be the case and suggest that an investigation could well turn up significant information.

Below are a few examples of previous reports on this topic.
Israel’s first heart transplant

Israel’s very first, historic heart transplant used a heart removed from a living patient without consent or consulting his family.

In December 1968 a man named Avraham Sadegat (the New York Times seems to give his name as A Savgat) (2) died two days after a stroke, even though his family had been told he was “doing well.”

After initially refusing to release his body, the Israeli hospital where he was being treated finally turned the man’s body over to his family. They discovered that his upper body was wrapped in bandages; an odd situation, they felt, for someone who had suffered a stroke.

When they removed the bandages, they discovered that the chest cavity was stuffed with bandages, and the heart was missing.

During this time, the headline-making Israeli heart transplant had occurred. After their initial shock, the man’s wife and brother began to put the two events together and demanded answers.

The hospital at first denied that Sadegat’s heart had been used in the headline-making transplant, but the family raised a media storm and eventually applied to three cabinet ministers. Finally, weeks later and after the family had signed a document promising not to sue, the hospital admitted that Sadagat’s heart had been used.
The hospital explained that it had abided by Israeli law, which allowed organs to be harvested without the family’s consent.  (3) (The United Nations Convention against Transnational Organized Crime includes the extraction of organs in its definition of human exploitation.)

Indications that the removal of Sadagat’s heart was the actual cause of death went unaddressed. 

Mysterious Scottish death
In 1998 a Scot named Alisdair Sinclair died under questionable circumstances while in Israeli custody at Ben Gurion airport.

His family was informed of the death and, according to a report in J Weekly, “…told they had three weeks to come up with about $4,900 to fly Sinclair’s corpse home. [Alisdair’s brother] says the Israelis seemed to be pushing a different option: burying Sinclair in a Christian cemetery in Israel, at a cost of about $1,300.”

The family scraped up the money, brought the body home, and had an autopsy performed at the University of Glasgow.
It turned out that Alisdair’s heart and a tiny throat bone were missing

At this point the British Embassy filed a complaint with Israel.

The J report states:

 “A heart said to be Sinclair’s was subsequently repatriated to Britain, free of charge. James wanted the [Israeli] Forensic Institute to pay for a DNA test to confirm that this heart was indeed their brother’s, but the Institute’s director, Professor Jehuda Hiss refused, citing the prohibitive cost, estimated by some sources at $1,500.” 

Doctor Jehuda Hiss
Despite repeated requests from the British Embassy for the Israeli pathologist’s and police reports, Israeli officials refused to release either.



* * * * * *

China’s illegal organ harvesting

Transplant consent in theory only

Rep. Christopher H. Smith

In the mid-1990s, I began holding hearings on the practice of organ harvesting of prisoners in China, and unfortunately, the controversial practice has not gone away. At a hearing for which I was co-chairman last week, two subcommittees of the House Foreign Affairs Committee heard that even though few Chinese voluntarily donate organs, China stands next behind the United States in the yearly number of organ transplants. With 600 transplant centers, it has become a destination for “transplant tourism.” Each transplant of a heart or liver can provide more than $100,000 in revenue.


 What adjectives can we use to describe the prospect that Chinese doctors and hospitals are engaged in large-scale harvesting of human organs for profit? The ordinary words such as “disturbing,” “appalling” or even “shocking” are inadequate.

So far, I have referred to ordinary transplants. But there’s a graver prospect. It is that Chinese military doctors may be engaged in organ harvesting from prisoners and labor-camp detainees, especially prisoners of conscience.


 China’s vice minister of health acknowledged in 2005 that almost all organs come from executed prisoners, but the number of executions in China is a “state secret.” In China, there are no firm statistics, no open waiting lists and no transparency in the granting of “consent.” From the few times Chinese doctors or health officials have discussed China’s transplant system at international meetings, the figures don’t add up. The best available outside estimates indicate that the number of transplants apparently exceeds the number of criminal executions. So then, what is the source of the additional organs?
 ….
The most gruesome testimony came from Chinese doctors who told Mr. Gutmann that some of the organs for transplant came from still-living victims.

Yes, these reports of horror sanctioned by a modern state beg for evidence, and proof is in short supply. But this possibility pushes us into a horrific beyond, a beyond that challenges our language, making “barbaric” too calm a word, too leached of horror.



http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/authors/SwedishTrans.html
http://www.counterpunch.org/2009/08/28/israeli-organ-harvesting/
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-11-01/organ-gangs-force-poor-to-sell-kidneys-for-desperate-israelis.html
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/sep/18/chinas-illegal-organ-harvesting/#ixzz2wNRsNUfR 

75 comments:

  1. WARNING TO READER:

    This site is an anti-semitic hate site and should be boycotted.

    ReplyDelete
  2. It's proprietor, Deuce, does not allow a Jewish man who has requested to post threads expressing an opposing view to do so.

    This site should be boycotted.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Ignore all crimes that lead back to Israel, or are committed by Israelis, or be called "anti-Semitic?"

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Inflate, create, distort and invent all crimes for Israel.

      Delete
    2. A daily diatribe about the invented crimes of the "Israeli" makes you anti-Semitic.

      Delete
    3. SEMITIC RELIGIONS

      The three main Semitic religions are. Christianity, Judaism and Islam. They are related by a common belief in God, the hereafter and the constant battle between good and evil.


      Please cut and paste where any mention of religion is made.

      Israel is not a religion.

      Delete
    4. http://www.quick-facts.co.uk/religion/semitic.html

      Delete
    5. The term "antisemitism" was coined by the German agitator and publicist, Wilhelm Marr in 1879. In that year.

      We do not speak or write German on this blog.
      We do not accept proto-NAZI terms to define either US or the ENGLISH language.

      We reject proto-NAZI ideologies, and propaganda terms as being acceptable.

      Again, cut and paste any derogatory mention of any specific religion is made.

      Delete

    6. If you wish to embrace Israeli propaganda, go right ahead.

      But it is rejected as a debate point or a cognizant argument.

      Delete

    7. If you wish to defend the harvesting of human body parts by Israel or China, go right ahead.

      ;-)

      Delete

    8. If you wish to tell us that Doctor Hiss is a liar, go right ahead.

      But he was telling the truth, he did harvest human body parts from dead human beings ,
      without authorization from their families.

      When the Dimwitted Duo have no other arrows in the quiver, they yell 'Racism'.

      LOL.

      It is a comical, but patterned reaction, from fools that have no other recourse.

      Delete
    9. thank you for posting your thread.

      It proves my point that you are in fact, an anti-Semite.

      There is no discussion of any issue with you as you will lie, invent, distort and misrepresent facts.

      But the general public will see, day after day, your threads and posts and draw the conclusion that this blog is a virus.

      have a nice day.

      Delete
  4. The single most important economic chart?

    Probably

    ReplyDelete

  5. Farmer Bob, Why don't you and 'Occupation is Human Suffering' fulfill YOUR desire and move to a 'Rat' free blog?

    He has one, it is set up, and ready for YOU!

    ReplyDelete
  6. Why is it that you are sticking T&A shots in with your illegal organ harvest thread? Is Rufus's inability to find his own porn the only reason? Are you trying to boost page views? If so why not just do a porn site?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Maybe, he just wants to see who it irritates. I know, I find it interesting, if not "instructive."

      Delete

  7. It is not PORN

    Just as network media programing, like FOX News uses pretty women as 'anchors'
    Just as Sun Newspaper has its 'Page 3' girl.

    Both of the UK’s daily tabloid newspapers -- The Sun and The Daily Star -- offer their readers something to look forward to each day, and I’m not talking about weather forecasts and "footie" results. Of course, what I’m referring to are the topless hotties featured within the early pages of each and every issue -- the beloved Page 3 girls (in The Sun) and Star Babes (in The Daily Star).

    These pages are where the careers of several famous models and TV personalities have been launched and it’s pretty much a national institution. Although feminists and other PC whiners have been lobbying for years to get the idea of Page 3 girls scrapped, fortunately, no one has paid these “activists” much attention. Due to the sheer popularity of the Page 3 girls, the feature has remained a fixture of British print media.


    We don't go for 'topless' just 'racy'

    Murdock is the most successful media mogul on the planet, I took note of that reality.




    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If you want people to 'see' the news, give a reason to look at the site.

      Murdock understands readers, I understand the reasoning he uses, and see no reason not to follow his lead.

      This blog is not the 'Wall Street Journal', it is a mass circulation tabloid.

      If the publisher doe not like it, he can take it down or e-mail me a note. He has done neither.

      Delete
    2. Yeah, that's what I meant to say. :) :)

      Delete
    3. Although feminists and other PC whiners ...

      Are you a PC whiner?
      You have never objected to the misogynistic rants of Farmer Bob, so I know you are no Feminist.

      Delete
    4. I am well aware of organizations using T&A to boost readership. Their incomes and existence are tied to their viewership. That is not the case at this blog.

      I like women and looking at them. However I do find it distasteful if I am reading about illegal organ harvest rings coupled with T&A shots or soldiers beating on folk peppered with sex shots. Heck, why not show dead kids shots coupled with T&A shots? Seems silly to me.

      And heck, why not go for topless instead of racy? Why not go full bore?

      Delete
    5. If you are luring people to the site to look at your T&A shots their not going to be interested in your version of the 'news'.

      Delete
    6. and no, it's got nothing to do with being a PC whiner, but rather a regular participant in this blog concerned about the direction it is going. It has morphed from a 'chat group' arguing politics, primarily foreign policy, to a soap box begging for page views.

      Delete
    7. “Don't hate the media; become the media.”

      ― Jello Biafra

      Post any thread you wish to on any subject that interests you.
      You have the authority and the technological knowledge to do so.

      Don't whine about my editorial decisions, take action and lead the way, Ash.

      Step up and DO SOMETHING.

      Delete
    8. I am, by confronting you on your decisions.

      Delete
    9. Though, I must say, I'm mostly inclined to be silent and go elsewhere.

      Delete
    10. Where was your "tasteful-meter" when Doug, and Wio were accusing me of wanting to "suck Obama's dick?"

      Delete
    11. Maybe you would have found it "distasteful" if I were accused of wanting to spank Michelle's ass?

      Delete
    12. Or when they were calling Deuce a NAZI.
      Desert Rat a murderer.

      There were no cries of 'distasteful', then.

      Your 'taste' meter is broken, Ash.

      You accept libel, but object to images of women.

      Do what you want to do. But do not use me as an excuse for your lack of initiative.

      Delete
    13. Fuck, there is a lot of shit spewed by a lot of people here. I am not in the habit of taking them all to task for each one of their idiocies nor do I feel inclined to argue with all the crap spouted by all and sundry. I've found that if I try to take most anything Bob writes seriously I go down an absurd rabbit hole trying to sort it out with him. One post comes to mind of late - his Am Thinker copy and paste on ACA and a Lou Gehrig's disease case. It was wrong on so many counts but I generally find that the case with Bob and anything out of AM Thinker. That post stood out because I was recently hired by a lawyer with Lou Gehrig's disease to do a final farewell before leaving to Switzerland where he can take matters into his own hands.

      I pick and choose what to deal with at my whim. In this case my whim is to query the usefulness of posting T&A shots interspersed with human suffering material in headline posts at 2164th's blog.

      Delete
    14. You need to loosen up, bubba. It's just a blog. :)

      Delete
    15. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    16. And I pick and choose what I want to post.

      If you do not enjoy it, pick something else.

      If you want to discuss the harvesting of body parts, I'm happy to discuss that, Ukraine, I''m all in. Russia, China, Iran, have at it.

      You want to discuss my editorial decisions, I'll discuss those, too.

      I am following in the footsteps of Rupert Murdock, the most successful publisher of the last and current centuries.
      He blazed the trail, he has lots of readers and influences lots of opinions.

      That is the reality. I will not deny it or even try to swim against the tide, because I do not find it objectionable.

      Delete
    17. In the small town from whence I hailed, there was a pretty danged good small-town newspaper. The old man covered the waterfront pretty well. He, also, interspersed little off-color jokes all through the thing. The women, and the church-people tut, tut, tutted, and read the damned thing word-for-word, start to finish. :)

      A hell of a publisher, he was.

      Delete
    18. Land management in the Western United States, I have had two or three posts on that subject.

      Border security, one or two posts.
      Ukraine, a couple in the last 25 have touched on that.

      Each thread devolves into accusations of anti-Antisemitism and family matters.
      Posters calling the threads 'dumb'.

      It is not just my threads. Yesterday the first contributor called the denounced the topic.

      Ever thread that Ms T posted, degenerated quickly into rants about Israel and Judaism, it drove her off.

      I won't be run off.
      Deuce can close the blog down, or cut me off, but if he doesn't I'm in for the duration.

      Contribute or leave, I do not have any control over that.
      You decide what you want to do.
      But I will do what I want to do, too.

      Delete
    19. It is just a blog, that's fer sure. I have found it a decent place at times to argue and discuss. Of late there are primarily two people rattling about, oh, and bob. Those pictures certainly are pulling in the punters...

      Delete
    20. Yesterday the first contributor ... denounced the topic.

      Delete

    21. There it is, stay or leave, read or not
      Contribute or not.

      Those are your decisions.

      I counter punch, attack me and I will respond.

      Call for shooting Arizonians and feeding the meat to the poor, I will not laugh it off.

      Call for shooting Israeli and feeding the meat to the poor, I will not laugh it off, either.
      But no one here has ever done THAT, have they?

      Delete

    22. Genocide, human butchery or cannibalism are not subjects of mirth.

      Delete

    23. Oh, and I am a firm believer in LONG story arcs.

      The 'Long War' is doctrine, now.

      Delete
    24. Jack wrote:
      "Genocide, human butchery or cannibalism are not subjects of mirth."

      Not subjects for mirth in your view but subjects for sex. You go girl!

      Delete

    25. That's right, Ash.

      Sex is life. What better way to fight barbarism, than by celebrating life?

      Delete

    26. Should we wallow in despair, and shout 'Woe is me', or stand up to the brutality and answer it with beauty?

      Delete
    27. your hypocrisy is showing.

      Delete

    28. Which end of the spectrum should we emphasize?

      Which do we want to win?

      I stand for beauty, with life and liberty, so do those women.
      They illustrate what is good, what is right, what is worth fighting for.

      Delete

    29. If you believe that it is hypocrisy, maybe you should join 'Occupation is Hate' and Farmer Bob.

      Click on the icon of 'Occupation is Apartheid', it'll take you to their blog.

      Delete

    30. Have a great day, I have to be going, now.

      Stay or leave, that decision is yours, and yours alone, to make.

      Delete
    31. The hypocrisy lies in your damnation of mirth with respect to those topics and your embrace of sex with respect to the same topics.

      It is also ironic that you and rufus condemn me for not taking to task Doug, Bob, WiO et al as justification for your actions. Ironic because we have condemn WiO for using the same argument in defence of Israel.

      Delete
    32. Of course it is my decision to post or not post, read or not read. It is impressive you figured that out all on your own.

      Delete
    33. "Condemn?"

      Would you care to point out, exactly, where I "condemned" you?

      Delete
    34. sorry, pardon the hyperbole - I was referring to your comment on my 'tasto-meter' not pinging on their comments regarding you sucking Obamas cock.

      Delete
  8. I don't see any sex going on in any thteads so far. I see beautiful bodies, but no sex Ash.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I've primarily referred to it as T&A. Call it what you will but I, personally, don't care for arousal to be associated with death, organ harvesting, murder and mayhem.

      Delete
    2. Personally, If I were having such a problem, I would probably just quit reading for awhile, and look at the pictures. Gotta be better for the soul. :)

      Delete
    3. Something tells me that Jack is building a "Long Arc" with the extreme sides of subject matter and the pics he uses to compile a post.
      It'll be interesting to see the results that transpire.

      Delete
    4. Like, look above Dougman. We've got a "Beautiful body" in a sexualized nurses outfit with her ass hanging out in a thong (yummy!) paired with the headline in bold type:

      "Palestinians accuse the Israeli army of selling the organs of its victims"

      Delete
    5. Rufus, there are plenty of places on the intertubes to look a pictures and I've never associated this place as being one of those. If there were whole posts dedicated to lovely pictures of women that'd be one thing. What I find...distasteful, is plowing through an article on, for example todays, illicit organ harvesting for profit, peppered with the odd picture of sexualized nurses (presumably related to the post because of their medical role). Do a post on girls in short skirts and no panties, or camel toes, or whatever - I don't care and I probably wouldn't say much but pair images of death with sexually arousing shots and I'll probably suggest you were demented, maybe even into necrophilia or rape.

      Delete
    6. " into necrophilia or rape"

      Holy Shit, Batman !!!

      :) :) :) Really?

      Delete
    7. if sex and death get you aroused....

      Delete
    8. :) Man, you need to get out more.

      It's a blog, Ash. We fuck around here for Entertainment. We're not going to jump on our little white horsies, and go out an fix all these wrongs that we observe, and write about. We don't get mad and kick the dog, and slap the wife around. It's a freakin' blog.

      We can tut-tut about the (fill in your favorite bugaboo, here) and still enjoy a picture of a fine, female ass.

      Have a drink, go sailing, play some golf, get laid, sell a deal.

      Go watch the Janet Yellen press conference on CNBC. She ain't no shrinking flower.

      Delete
    9. :) I like looking at pictures of beautiful women in kinky outfits but I don't like pairing gross things with those images - you know; organ harvesting, murder, death and pics of dead people. If you get your kicks out of sexual images paired with dead people then it brings us back to

      ta dum

      necrophilia.

      Delete
    10. :) Whatever.

      In the meantime, just think of them as "commercials."

      Delete
  9. I’m with you Ash. I don’t like it.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    2. Aye, we are all legends in our own mind!

      Delete
  10. Wednesday's I interview with the doc.

    Today I asked about the cost.

    $40,000 for 8 weeks of external beam radiation prostate cancer treatment, including EVERYTHING, the doc's fees, the machine and tech fees from the Catholic Hospital. Since I pay Supplemental you can reduce that to $32,000, TOTAL.

    Jackratass was claiming I had filched $700,000 from the 'welfare' system.

    I am 67 years of age, have paid into the system all my life, and I happen to one of the still minority of men that have prostate cancer.

    $32,000.

    Jackrat was off more than 20X.

    Jackrat is as usual and expected FULL OF SHIT. Full of steamy loose smelly shit, that has infected what is loosely called a brain, but is really just a spiteful, slanderous, BS machine.

    That $40,000 by the way also covers all the followups.

    bob, whose thing has flipped out again

    ReplyDelete
  11. Forgot to say 'out'.

    Bob

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I do not know why it flips me over to only having the choice of anon, but I think it has something to do with having three email addresses now.

      Bob

      out out

      Delete
    2. I forgot to mention the doc's professional fee is $6,000, which is INCLUDED in the above figures.

      Bob

      out out out

      Delete
    3. A brain is actually a Consciousness reducing and focusing mechanism.

      See: Hinduism and it's echoes down the ages and on into our time in Transpersonal Psychology.

      In rat's case it works exceedingly well, all too well.

      Bob

      Had to get that in.

      out out out out I promise

      Delete
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    ReplyDelete
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    ReplyDelete