Thousands flee Fighting in Pakistani Valley
Two days ago, the headlines were trumpeting the possible half million refugees expected as a result of new found Pakistani backbone in the Swat region. I thought to myself, "Now this is what one would expect to see; a column of refugees fleeing before an advancing army." Historically, it is the prudent thing to do. Gather up essential possessions, put them on a push cart and get out before all hell breaks loose.
An entire generation has lived with the aberration of the Palistinians who are held firmly imprisoned by the United Nations or would simply rather sacrifice themselves to the Jews. The thought of hundreds of thousands of Swat refugees was a perversely comforting reminder of the way things should be.
Chrysler in Hand, Fiat turns to Opel
The Little Italian automaker, Fiat, is apparently gorging on the table scraps thrown off by the recent economic "downturn". Yes, we are led to believe that a miracle manager, a senor Sergio Marchionne, has led his company to economic prosperity even as his industry peers face ruin. I know that I can be skeptical, somewhat pessimistic and a bit negative but I'm sorry, I'll believe this miracle when I see it. My gut tells me that there is more going on here than meets the eye. It sounds like some sort of Italian job.
The First US Non-Victim of Swine Flu
Apparently, we can only conclude that she had swine flu when she died. Do not conclude that swine flu killed her. As has been done in Mexico recently, the death will be ascribed to something like pneumonia or pulmonary failure. Anything except the influenza.
HARLINGEN, Texas – This week should have been a joyous time for Judy Trunnell, a 33-year-old teacher who had just given birth to a healthy baby girl. But the friends and relatives whose cars lined the quiet street in front of her home in a quiet subdivision Tuesday instead were mourning her, the first American citizen with swine flu to die.
Trunnell died after being hospitalized for two weeks. She slipped into a coma, and her baby was delivered by Cesarean section, said a cousin, Mario Zamora.
"She was just a beautiful person, warm at heart. She worked with disabled children as a teacher," Zamora told WMAR-TV in Baltimore. "Those that knew her will always remember her."
Texas health officials stopped short of saying that swine flu caused Trunnell's death. State health department spokeswoman Carrie Williams said the teacher had "chronic underlying health conditions" but wouldn't give any details.
It seems that in addition to the actual deceased, there are two victim groups impacted by this particular strain of virus. 1. Mexicans. and 2. The porcine population. A few people get sick in the whirled and Mexicans have to suffer more humiliation, impoverishment and discrimination and pigs have to die by the hundreds of thousands.
Woe unto he that is reincarnated as a pig or a Mexican.
The Slaying of Master Sergeant Davis
ReplyDelete-
Military Advisers at Heart of U.S. Mission in Iraq
Video, NY Times Front Page
videos now play well @ full screen
GA Serves America
ReplyDeleteHarrison Ford for General Aviation
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteDunnigan from Strategy Page
ReplyDelete(a liberal on the Dems destruction of jobs)
ReplyDelete...Cessna has canceled a new Executive Jet Progject, even tho it stirred a lot of interest/advance orders.
Thanks, Barry.
Once the civilian population is locked down, surrounded by the attacking army, there is little hope for evacuation, for civilian refugees.
ReplyDeleteWarsaw in 1943 exemplifies that condition, as does Gaza, today.
The folks in Swat are not walled into a ghetto, but are living free in the mountains, able to come and go, as they wish.
So they are leaving Swat, thinking they'll be back, when the fighting is over.
The Palis know that if they leave their homes, there is no going back.
The historical precedent, on that point, for them, is clear.
G.M. Is Said to Seek a Stake in Fiat
ReplyDelete...and the Gaza Problem would not exist had not the Jews been run out of Europe and almost ALL the Muslim/Arab countries.
ReplyDelete...as were the Palis from some.
"Warsaw in 1943 exemplifies that condition, as does Gaza, today.
ReplyDeletealways a pathetic comparison.
"So they are leaving Swat, thinking they'll be back, when the fighting is over.
The Palis know that if they leave their homes, there is no going back."
the palestinians left so that the jews could be eradicated and pushed into the ocean.
Also from Strategy Page
ReplyDeleteApril 9. 2009: The government reported that a former Guatemalan special operations soldier was killed in a gun battle with federal police in Zacatecas state (northern Mexico). The dead man was identified as Israel Nava.
A ghetto is a ghetto, the comparison perfectly valid.
ReplyDeleteThe Palis did not leave Gaza, as duece reported, they died in place, just months ago, well over 1,000 of them.
That be a fact that even the Israeli agree to.
Were the people of Warsaw lobbing missiles @neighbors?
ReplyDelete"A ghetto is a ghetto, the comparison perfectly valid."
ReplyDeleteyou play the perfect fool, rat.
out of all the ghettos out there you like to choose the Warsaw one.
just because it was a ghetto.
Now, back in my younger days, it was Israelis that were the primary trainers of the Guatemalan "Kaibiles".
ReplyDeleteAnother matter of fact.
Now there are Israelis along with their trained Guat Kaibiles training the Zetas and other cartel narco-terrorists, in Mexico.
Prepping them to kill ever more Americans.
No, because it was encirled by an opppsing force, and the residents did not flee.
ReplyDeleteThere were few refugees, from Gaza in 2008 or Warsaw in 1943.
That is the comparison, it stands.
There is a difference in the mentalities of ghetto dwellers and rural mountain folk, that being the main point.
ReplyDeleteRural folk will get ip and go, urban dwellers tend to hunker down, at least in the early stages of conflict.
If the urbanites are subsequently cut off from excape, they tend to die in place, as long as the battle continues.
Human behaviours exemplified in both Warsaw and Gaza.
this rat is now saying israelis are prepping people to kill americans? i think he has become more than just the mortar for the bricks of anti.... naw never mind he'll just deny it anyway.
ReplyDeleteI wonder what stand he made on the mafia?
The same was seen in France, as the Germans advanced. The French people abandoned the countryside, to the point that French military traffic was disrupted.
ReplyDeleteBut the French people did not abandon Paris. They hunkered down, there. Perhaps because they had no where else to run.
Well, slim, it is true that Israel will sell any technologies that they can to the historical enemies of the US.
ReplyDeleteLike China and Russia.
It is true that Israeli have trained the Guatemalan commandos, and it is true that Israeli are training the Mexican drug cartels, as they did in Colombia, back in the day.
You and other readers are free to draw whatever conclusions that come to mind, from those facts.
The Israeli have killed US service members in the past, slim.
ReplyDeleteI imagine they could again, in the future.
If it was seen to be in the Israeli national interest.
What they've done before, they'd do again.
rat, how many americans did the mafia kill?
ReplyDelete"Prepping them to kill ever more Americans"
you wrote this, not anyone else. you got the fool thing down.
DR, Germany, Italy and Japan are historical enemies of the US too. We ourselves sell shit to them.
ReplyDeleteWell they are prepping to kill ever more Americans, slim, that is a fact. Just as Israeli Col. Yair (Kiuen> prepped Pablos natco-terrorists to kill Colombians, in South America. So there too, an Israeli was helping to kill Americans.
ReplyDeleteRead about him, from a 1991 US Government report.
He is listed at #80.
These are real facts, not feelings.
The mafia? whose, the Sicilian mafia, the Mexican mafia, or the Chinese mafia, which mafia are you speaking of?
Or do you combine them together?
That is correct, Ms T, we sell lots of military stuff to lots of folk.
ReplyDeleteShould we?
I think not, myself.
Our bad behaviour does not excuse it in others. While the bad behaviour of others does not provide excuse for US, either.
I am not much of a supporter of the application of situational ethics, as more and more of you folks are, seemingly, coming to support.
ReplyDeleteI'm all for selling stuff to Japan.
ReplyDelete...the rest not so much.
Colombia to for Trish,
and to stick it up BHO's ass.
IDF choppers in service of drug cartel:
ReplyDelete"The dubious affair, which was already investigated by the Israeli Defense Ministry, and later turned over to the hands of the police, was uncovered about two years ago.
Investigators revealed that the Defense Ministry signed a deal with an Israeli company three years ago, contracting it to negotiate the sale of five IAF helicopters for a sum of USD 100,000 per aircraft.
The ministry permitted the choppers, of a MD 500 Defender model, be sold either to the Mexican federal police, or to the Spain firefighters department. However, contrary to the terms of the license, the copters ended up in Columbia, by way of Canadian mediators.
A Defense Ministry spokeswoman said in response that "after suspicions were raised that an illicit exchange took place, the ministry launched an initial investigation into the matter last year."
ok rat, tell me how israeli oranges with israeli labels on them wound up in iran without israel knowing??
you know what mafia i am talking about. from one of the historical enemies xena mentioned. i know you can figure it out.
the Rat speaks: Once the civilian population is locked down, surrounded by the attacking army, there is little hope for evacuation, for civilian refugees.
ReplyDeleteWarsaw in 1943 exemplifies that condition, as does Gaza, today.
Warsaw Ghetto is the SAME as GAZA?
Come on rat...
what a load of shit...
Gaza we NEVER surrounded by an attacking army LIKE the Warsaw Ghetto was...
To liken GAZAN as locked down by attacking armies doesnt tell the truth...
Gazan's for want of VIAGRA and other consumer product's had NO problem in storming thier BROTHER Arab's border (no army there) to invade Egypt....
and there are HUNDREDS of tunnels going to and from gaza into egypt....
I love the Pat Buchanan type comparison of Gaza with the Warsaw Ghetto...
Complete horseshit....
Speaking of Horseshit and Viagra:
ReplyDeleteImagine a Horse on Viagra!
Damned hoofer would be rivaling al-Doug
rat still spouts:
ReplyDeleteThere were few refugees, from Gaza in 2008 or Warsaw in 1943.
That is the comparison, it stands.
Utter nonsense....
The AVERAGE Gazan DOES NOT FEAR THE IDF....
Whether you like or not, Israel was and IS not trying to mass murder the population of GAZA...
In the last 6 months alone...
Israel has provided over 6 million Liters of fuel and 17,000 tons of food for the gazan population
During Operation Cast Lead, 99.9% of all homes were not targeted by the IDF...
and those home that were? were NOTIFIED, YES NOTIFIED that they were going to be hit...
this is NOT the WARSAW GHETTO....
EVER WONDER WHY THOUSANDS OF PALESTINIANS STAND IN FRONT OF A FEW IDF SOLDIERS THROWING ROCKS AND FIRE BOMBS AND NOT RUNING FOR COVER?
Because they KNOW israel is not going to MACHINE GUN THEM DOWN....
LIKE HAMAS would do, LIKE the NAZIS did, Like the Taliban DOES.....
Rat stop sniffing the ass of neo-nazis your hanging out with...
whhhhiiinnnnnneyooyyyyyy
ReplyDelete---
Don't forget that "Islam Day" there in Hawaii, al -Doug!
September 24, if memory serves.
Christian Day (Dec 25) is a paid holiday for us Feds. Let Hawaii have their Islam Day or Chalk Appreciation Week or what-have-you.
ReplyDeleteI read somewhere the Israelis provide Gaza with its electriciy.
ReplyDeleteI'd think they might consider turning it off when the missiles fly, but they don't seem to ever do it.
I would.
When they left, they left functioning green houses behind, prompty trashed.
I don't remember ever reading of any such like things in the Warsaw ghetto.
I want an Odin Day.
ReplyDeleteTain't fair without it.
I want an Odin Day.
ReplyDeleteThor is the greatest superhero ever.
I consider Blackwater, a group of retired US military, to be an extension of the US Government.
ReplyDeleteWhile technically a private organization, the majority of its' operators, ex-US military, not "real" expatrioti.
I consider the Taliban commanders to be agents of the Pakistani. Supported and funded for years, by the ISI.
I always saw the Israelis, in Guatemala, acting as US proxies, due to the nature of the relationshhip between the US Congress and Guat Government. The Guats not favoring the go along to get along advise they were recieving from US, through front door channels.
The US Executive working the back door, through Israel. Now that, slim, is a feeling, not a fact.
The Israeli could have just been acting out of their own national interests, in Guatemala.
Bobal, Ayn Rand called that the sanction of the victims. Her advice was, "Don't support your own destroyers".
ReplyDelete'Rat reminds me:
ReplyDeleteOliver North says resurgence of bombing has nothing to do w/al-Q in Iraq:
It's the IRANIANS responding to BHO's weak ass ideas about persuading them to stop the Nuke program.
Dork
Why didn't the residents of the ghetto, in Warsaw, flee?
ReplyDeleteThey saw the Germans advancing, but they did not leave their homes, as the people in the countryside did.
Why not?
duece compared the actions of the people in Swat to the folks in Gaza. How different they behave.
It is evident that the folks in Gaza cannot flee, except perhaps to the Sinai. Where there are no facilities for another million people.
They know that if they did, leave, they could never return.
In Pakistan they are unassing the AO and in Afganistan during the Russian War, a million took flight.
I see it as an urban/rural divide in behaviour, more than anything else.
But again, slim, why did the people not flee Warsaw's ghetto as the Germans approached?
The threat seemed clear enough, both contemperaneously and in hindsight.
rat. you are confused because you are trying to compare apples to oranges. that is why i find you so foolish at times.
ReplyDeleteThey had no where to go. The Poles being as anti-semitic as the Germans.
ReplyDeleteBeware Libertarian Purity. It leads to things like auctioning off the national forests as playgrounds for the Super Rich, comparing Gaza to the Warsaw ghetto, and the election of folks like Al Frankenstein.
Slim, Spokane, Washington is the only place I know of (there may be others) where some of the street names are taken from the old nordic theology. Freya Street, that sort of thing.
ReplyDeleteI may be in the enviable position of naming six streets in Moscow, Idaho, if my plat is agreed to by the city. (not that it will be built anytime soon)
It's a tradition here that the developer name the streets.(within good taste of course)
I'm considering this matter carefully. I need something out of the ordinary, something with a little jazz to it, something like--the names of the Board of Directors of the Elephant Bar! :)
Rufus Road, Sam Street, Desert Rat Roundabout, al-Doug Avenue....Bobal Boulevard....Linear Lane
ReplyDeleteExactly, doug, no matter the President of the United States, whether it be Geirge W or Barack H, the Iranians will be creating mischief in Iraq.
ReplyDeleteBut then again, they always have and always will, from viewing all of the historical precedents.
The fiasco in Iraq has eliminated the possibility of siezing their oil fields, with the military, as mat advocated. The window for that opportunity closed long ago, here in the homeland.
Without guarenteeng the free flow of Iranian oil, the whirled economy shudders to a halt.
The current economic malaise, remember it was the oil shock that brought it on, not the bankng crisis. The oil shock broke the back of the enfeedled banks, which exacerbated the recession, but did not cause it.
Our Asian partners, once and future enemies, require that oil to flow. As a consequence of the economic interconnections that have developed since 1948 the US needs that oil to flow, as well.
More so than any other interest in that Region the free flow of oil impacts the Homeland, directly.
Her advice was, "Don't support your own destroyers".Not a big Ayn Rand fan here, but that advice makes perfect sense.
ReplyDeletethor is the son of odin. valhalla road has a ring.
ReplyDeleteOh, oh, this sounds bad.--
ReplyDeleteEU quarantines London in flu panic
The EU is considering a travel advisory for Mexico
There has been a small outbreak of “zombism” in London due to mutation of the H1N1 virus into new strain: H1Z1.
Similar to a scare originally found in Cambodia back in 2005, victims of a new strain of the swine flu virus H1N1 have been reported in London.
After death, this virus is able to restart the heart of it’s victim for up to two hours after the initial demise of the person where the individual behaves in extremely violent ways from what is believe to be a combination of brain damage and a chemical released into blood during “resurrection.”
The World Health Organization (WHO) has raised the alert to phase six, its highest level, and advised governments to activate pandemic contingency plans.
from BC
The urbanites, in Poland, Gaza and Paris had no where to go.
ReplyDeleteThe folk in the countryside, fled toqards the percieved security and safety of urban areas.
While the urbanites hunkered down, at home, percieving a sense of security and safety in the familar and in their numbers.
Making the decision that from the urban center there was no where safer to flee to.
When the Mongols advanced into what's become Iran, Turkey and Iraq the natives fled to the cities and hunkered down behind their walls.
As they did in Troy.
I'd advance that the urban condition has a lot to do with the behaviour.
People percieve safety when massed together, even if that safety is not a reality.
Yeah, Hawaii is so Muslim they have Islam Day, and the women must dress in accordance with Sharia Law.
ReplyDeleteFamily Tree of the Norse Gods--
ReplyDelete--
To compliment the Kibbie Dome at the University of Idaho, we have the Siggie Dome, built by local farmer Sig Jorstad, to keep his farm egquipment in. It sits a little outside of Pullman, a monument to the Nordic past.
Those ladies make you seem fully dressed, Xena.
ReplyDeleteZombies ahead.
ReplyDeleteQatar eyes multimillion dollar hotel in Cuba.
ReplyDeleteQatar to become first Arab country to invest in Cuba's booming tourism sector as it inks deal in Havana.
HAVANA - Qatar and Cuba on Wednesday launched a joint 75-million-dollar project to create a five-star resort on the Caribbean island, officials said.
ReplyDeleteCopulating cadavers turn stomachs in Berlin
Zombie flu victum fights off rape attempt by cadaver.
ReplyDeleteI'm goin' back to bed.
Anyone, nation or criminal group, that threatens the free flow of oil on the global market is an enemy of the interests of the United States.
ReplyDeleteThere is no "enemy" oil.
Every drop is needed to fuel our economic recovery.
wi"o" postulating that Israel will act against US interests, the resulting depression will then be blamed upon Israel and then by extention, Jews in United States.
As the drumbeats of revenge are banged with fervour the Civilian Corps Brownshirts will descend upon the Jewish communities of the US in "Night of the Long Knives: scenario.
Funny, slim, you did not speak up and defend the people or the Government of the United States from the disparagement made by the comparison, of US, to the NAZIs.
By a "Friend of Israel" in the US.
ReplyDeleteOliver North: One guy you do NOT want to listen to.
ReplyDeleteOllie got burnt by the light, he's damaged goods.
ReplyDeleteTells War Stories, for a living.
Lives for the light, now.
Guy's a bad penny. Or a booger. Like Ledeen. Just can't seem to shake that MF.
ReplyDeleteReason #5006 why the Republican Party is a joke.
ReplyDeleteMy dear friend habu is looking for a few good men to infiltrate the Democratic Party.
ReplyDeleteHe's positively inspired by Alinsky's Secrets of Success.
I think you can probably claim him as an acolyte, Rat.
ReplyDeleteit's funny how you think you are the perfect american. our country was not made great by people with "rat-like" mentalities. i guess i didn't read it that closely but if he pulled a ward churchill and called us "little Eichmanns" i would have told him or anyone to get effed along with you. my guess is that you are playing the fool again and to deny the existance of hate groups in our diverse country is just plain moronic (even for one that has self-annointed himself as captain america).
ReplyDeleteThe Palis know that if they leave their homes, there is no going back.
ReplyDeleteThe historical precedent, on that point, for them, is clear...
They'vw had their chances over the last 60 years.
Apples and oranges, rat.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThe folks in the Gaza know there is no where else to go. The story of the previous set of refugees, in Jordon and Lebanon, giving proof to that.
ReplyDeleteSome Palistinians have been refugees, for 60 years. Some have both been born and died, in those UN camps. The US paying about 24% of the administrative cost of the containment.
Beyond that, lineman, the 60 year reference escapes me. The past 60 years drive the point, just as the Jews of Warsaw had no where better to go, so it goes for the residents of Gaza.
Or Paris, for that matter.
Answer the questions slimslider, charecter assasination won't work, here.
ReplyDeleteCome on, why did the people of Warsaw not flee?
The threat was clear, well expressed. There was a movie, recently, with the new James Bond actor playing the lead. Story of Jews in the Ukraine or somewhere in Russia that did flee. Then set up a resistence.
Fought back from the wilderness.
I do not know the whole story, yet, but dollars to donuts they were rural Jews, living outside the cities.
We'll see.
Slim @ Thu May 07, 11:09:00 AM EDT
ReplyDeleteI'm late to the debate, as usual.
Let me finish catching up.
Meantime, the sun shines on the Sierras. Time for more coffee.
Have a nice day, y'all.
rat wants people to believe that the jews had a choice in warsaw. as if they were rejecting peace or even a chance at it.
ReplyDeletei used be around a lot of native american ritual and cultural activities in my younger years while still dating. i remember this one person who seemed to know all there was to know about it and how things should be done. it sadened me to later find out that they weren't native american at all. not sure why this person reminds me of rat because he is the greatest american on internet.
rat you have not answered my previous questions why do you expect different?
The movie trailerDefienceFrom wiki
ReplyDeleteUnder their protection, 1,200 Jews survived the war, making it one of the most successful rescue missions of the Holocaust. The group spent more than two years living in the forests and were initially organized by members of the Bielski family.
The Bielski family were farmers in Stankiewicze (Stankievichy) near Nowogródek (Navahrudak), an area that, at the beginning of the Second World War, belonged to the Second Polish Republic, but in September 1939 was seized by the Soviet Union, which was then allied with Nazi Germany under the Nazi-Soviet Pact.
... Nowogródek became a Jewish ghetto, as Nazis took over those lands and implemented their genocidal policies (see Holocaust in Poland and Holocaust in Belarus).
...
The four Bielski brothers, Tuvia Bielski, Alexander Bielski (1906-1995) also known as "Zus", Asael Bielski, and Aron Bielski managed to flee to the nearby forest after their parents and other family members were killed in the ghetto in December 1941. Together with 13 neighbors from the ghetto, they formed the nucleus of their partisan combat group which was formed in the spring of 1942. Originally the group consisted of around forty people but grew quickly.
The group's commander was the eldest brother Tuvia, who had served in the Polish Army from 1927 to 1929, rising to the rank of corporal. He had been interested in the Zionist youth movement. Tuvia "would rather save one old Jewish woman than kill ten German soldiers". He sent emissaries to infiltrate the ghettos in the area, recruiting new members to join the group in the Naliboki Forest. Hundreds of men, women, and children eventually found their way to the Bielski camp; at its peak 1,230 people belonged to the group, and 70% of its membership consisted of women, children, and the elderly. No one was turned away. About 150 engaged in armed operations.[1]
The country boys fled and then fought back, surviving to live in the US, while the urbanites in Warsaw stood their ground, then died.
The lessons of more than 60 years, there.
Blogger bobal said...
ReplyDeleteRufus Road, Sam Street, Desert Rat Roundabout, al-Doug Avenue....Bobal Boulevard....Linear Lane
Thu May 07, 11:21:00 AM EDT...
Beats hell out of MLD Boulevard or Avenida Cesar Chavez.
Don't let us down, Bob.
No, slim, I;m saying they chose not to run for their lives. Just as the people in Swat chose to scadaddle.
ReplyDeleteBut in Waraw, as in Gaza, they just hunkered down and hoped for the best.
That is the point and the comparison. People in cities tend not to flee, but to hunker down.
People from rural areas give ground, pick up and move.
desert rat said...
ReplyDeleteThe urbanites, in Poland, Gaza and Paris had no where to go.
The Palestinians of Gaza do not "flee" Israelis...
they do not fear them because Israel does not threaten them with mass extermination.
If the gazans were fearful they COULD flee into the Sinai, as they have done when they heard of giant SALE on Viagra, motor bikes, & fresh porn...
The reason arabs in the past had fled before incoming israelis is that the arab leaders told them the israelis were butchers and rapists...
the arabs may hate to admit the truth but the IDF does not act like saddam hussein, assad or even the King of Jordan...
The reason gazans dont FLEE is there is NO reason to...
as for the warsaw ghetto...
Jews were BROUGHT to the sealed ghetto from all around (under armed nazi guard) to be collected there, at the start the Germans spent a fortune on radio and flyers telling the Jews that they were to be "reloctated" to Jewish only towns...
Some Jews DID try to escape...
The USS St Louis comes to mind... 930 German Jews REFUSED in 1938 entrance to both Cuba and Florida and rat I KNOW you will be proud, the USA sent the Coast Guard out to prevent any Jews from swimming to Miami (whose lights were clearly visible from the boat), and thus those Jews were returned to Europe and then all were murdered in the camps...
Gazans have increased in population since 1967 by 3 fold...
They fuck and suck and eat and crap alot....
Israel provides 30% of their electric, millions of liters of fuel, tens of thousands of truckloads of foods...
israel does not starve the gazans, does treat MANY of them free of charge in Israeli hospitals and is completely withdrawn from the lands of gaza...
Gaza is not a Ghetto...
It shares an international border with Egypt, the world's largest arab occupied country.
To compare in any way Gaza to Warsaw is specious at best, inciteful and anti-semitic at worse...
Last time i checked Nazi Germany never gave the Jews of Warsaw greenhouses worth $350,000,000 in sales of food products...
Last time i checked Nazi Germany never gave the jews an area of Poland to live and rule themselves...
rat's pov
ReplyDeleteBut in Waraw, as in Gaza, they just hunkered down and hoped for the best.
That is the point and the comparison. People in cities tend not to flee, but to hunker down.
Again more rat droppings...
40% of Gazans WANT to LEAVE but Hamas PREVENTS THEM, not Israel.
Gazans are not scared by the "army surrounding them" they are scared by Hamas....
your points of comparison are garbage
Okay, the reason that the Gazans did not flee, they are not in any percieved danger.
ReplyDeleteThat is another possible answer to duece's question. The Gazani do not fear Israeli combat air, armor and field artillery.
There's a lot of truth in that idea.
The Egypt border has been closed for a while now. Walls and fence and stuff. That's why the illicit tunnels are in existance, the border is "closed".
So there is half the answer, the Gazani are not afraid of dying, while those in Swat fear the Pakistani Army.
Another perspective, to be sure.
It's over forty years since I read much about the Warsaw Ghetto, so I had to refresh my memory a bit. For starters, I'd probably agree with rat that the urban populations will behave differently than their country cousins. Beyond that, comparisons break down. One thing I seemed to recall that wasn't described at Wiki is that the ghetto partitioning and subsequent atrocities came on relatively slowly, like the frog in the pot analogy. Would Stalingrad be a better WWII comparison for rat's description of the civilian populace facing the onslaught of a hostile army and fleeing?
ReplyDeleteThe Warsaw Ghetto was established by the Nazi German Governor-General Hans Frank on October 16, 1940. At this time, the population of the Ghetto was estimated to be 440,000 people, about 38% of the population of Warsaw.
...
During the next year and a half, thousands of the Polish Jews as well as some Romani people from smaller cities and the countryside were brought into the Ghetto, while diseases (especially typhus) and starvation kept the inhabitants at about the same number.
...
The final battle started on the eve of Passover, April 19, 1943, when the large Nazi force entered the ghetto. After initial setbacks, the Germans under the field command of Jürgen Stroop systematically burned and blew up the ghetto buildings, block by block, rounding up or murdering anybody they could capture. Significant resistance ended on April 23, 1943, and the Nazi operation officially ended in mid-May, symbolically culminated with the demolition of the Great Synagogue of Warsaw on May 16, 1943. According to the official report, at least 56,065 people were killed on the spot or deported to German Nazi concentration and death camps, most to Treblinka...
Wiki
Hardly qualifies for comparison to Gaza, seems to me, since I take WiO's and Bob's accounts to be fairly accurate as to IDF v. Pali interactions (as they reinforce my own opinions).
40% want to leave, to go where?
ReplyDeleteOn whose passport?
Certainly not a Gazani one.
Israel could issue those Gazani passports, if it wanted to.
It has occupational control of the geography. It controls the energy and water infrastructure.
In many ways Gazani are Israeli.
Especially if they are not Palistinis, since there is no Palistine.
Palestinians are free to declare independence any time they want. We didn't ask King George for permission or a UN mandate. That they haven't done it and won't do it is due to their business model as a professional victim-state.
ReplyDeleteThe comparison is in that the 56,000 or more Jews did not become refugees.
ReplyDeleteThe question remains why?
Did they not see the threat, or did they have faith in their community's ability to withstand the German Army?
The Gazani have not become refugees, as duece thought they should be, when compared to the people leaving Swat.
Why are the civilians leaving Swat and not Gaza.
Percieved danger
On that wi"o" and I agree. In Gaza the people see more danger in fleeing than in hunkering down.
Becoming a refugee is worse than residing in Gaza under the recent and current conditions.
Besides, no one will take them.
It's like a giant Gitmo.
With the inmates running the grounds.
The people of Swat are beating feet, sure that the Pakistani Army is coming, that they will not be half-stepping when they do.
Stalingrad may well be a better example, lineman, but the principle idea remains the same.
ReplyDeleteCivilians that chose or are forced to remain in the urban enviorments, in the face of enemy assualt.
Masses of civilians, retreating before the enemy only hampers either counter offensive or even deliberate defensive operations, As witnessed in South Korea.
Rat droppings.
ReplyDeleteMan, that's just mean.
Rat's an omniscient, omnipotent desert badass, not just some rodent who's full of shit.
None so blind, slim, as those who refuse to see.
None so blind.
We all really should be sitting at his feet.
ReplyDeleteHis little pink rat feet.
And sweeping up his droppings ("Russell Company blah blah blah...Skull and Bones blah blah blah...") with joyful devotion.
I just finished a fascinating book called "The Long Walk" by Slavomir Rawicz. He was a Polish cavalry officer, not a Jew, at the outbreak of WWII. He explained that after the Russians broke through on the east and the Germans on the west, there was no place to go and the decision became who to surrender to. Who would be less brutal. Might explain why there weren't many refugees from Warsaw.
ReplyDeleteI've got the broom and dustpan, sweetheart.
ReplyDeleteReady when you are.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteLet me know when you're in town.
ReplyDeleteI'll turn out the cat
Ahh, yes, when the musings don't fit the Party line, trish.
ReplyDeleteSweep 'em up.
That conspiracies, cabals, spies and generational dynasties and political factions with diverse interests exist everywhere else in the wide whirled, but in the US, where those type things are just not allowed.
Or are just not widely reported upon.
Anyone who wants tp, they can decide for themselves, which themes make sense to them.
That for 40 years Lester Crown has supported and nourished a cabal of conpatriots. From their defeat in 1968 to their triumph on 20Jan09.
Now, something I never heard mentioned, about Rev. Wright, the fellow that Barack H listened to for 20 years. You all know the fella.
What is his position on Armegeddon?
Is he a Christian Zionist?
Does he believe that human actions can create the conditions for the second coming?
Where does his theology stand, on that, and did his views come to influence Barack H.?
Lame, Rat.
ReplyDeleteWhit,
In re the tsunami: Eighteen year old boy, child of person of prominence, on the loose in Colombia. Use your imagination.
My mother: Payback's a bitch, isn't it, Trish?
Me: Why, yes, mom. Yes, it is.
[Ding!]
Elevator Operator: Welcome to the 87th floor of hell.
@ Thu May 07, 04:21:00 PM EDT
ReplyDeleteJesus Christ, WHATEVER, you obnoxious turd.
I know, trish.
ReplyDeleteNot really in the mood for a Russell Company adventure, right now,
Just trying to fit all the pieces into an acceptable mosaic, some pieces fit fine, like a Remington painting, while others give it the look of a Dali piece, as interrperted by Picaso
And a good time was had by all, well almost.
ReplyDelete:-)
No broken mirrors, chairs entact...
ReplyDeleteJust a little blood and glass on the floor.
Quiet morning at the bar.
Not lookin' for an echo chamber, are ya?
ReplyDeleteHell no.
ReplyDeleteLike the new outfit, slim suggested that it'd be a good fit.
ReplyDeleteHillary's money man looks spiffy in an orange jumpsuit--
ReplyDelete(Reuters) - A swindler whose arrest in 2007 prompted Hillary Clinton to return $850,000 in Democratic Party campaign contributions from fundraising, pleaded guilty on Thursday to fraud charges in an investment scheme.
Businessman Norman Hsu, who was sentenced to three years in jail by a California state judge in January 2008, pleaded guilty in Manhattan federal court to a criminal indictment of mail fraud and wire fraud in running a Ponzi scheme of up to $60 million.
U.S. prosecutors said that from 2000 through August 2007, Hsu convinced investors to put up to $60 million into the scheme, in which early investors are paid with the money of new clients.--
--
Unmentioned in the above discussion is the fact that Gaza has a long seacoast, Warsaw, well, not so much.
And, if worse comes to worst, there's always Gaza International Airport.
Any Gazan that can't get out just isn't tryin'.
---
Deuce Drive, Whit Way....
Not bad, Rat, not bad at all, if I do say so myself.
ReplyDeleteThe Israeli closed the airport and have blockaded the coast, bob.
ReplyDeleteDo I have to go find the stories, with the peace activists on boats rammed by the Israeli Navy.
They are embargo'd, bob. That's an act of war, in and of itself.
The truce or cease fire is only partial, and not providing any long term solution, either political or military. On the West Bank or in Gaza. That's why an International force will become part of the solution.
I still cling to the belief that ol' Norman self medicated on that AMTRAK train in Colorado so's to evade Hillary's consultants.
ReplyDeleteOr, was it her winged monkeys?
He could have been disappeared like so many cats in Republican neighborhoods during the nineties.
They are embargo'd, bob. That's an act of war, in and of itself...
ReplyDeleteHow do you embargo your own citizens, as you implied above?
More like putting a fence around a village of rabid prairie dogs it would seem.
heh, it does appear Gaza International is closed for repairs and maintainence at this time, but it was going good until the al-Aqsa Intifada.
ReplyDeleteI like you backgrounded by the flag better, Rat, but that's just me.
ReplyDeleteThe "Gaza" is the same size a Scottsdale, Arizona, bob. The coastline cannot be "long", just because of the size of the place, geographicly.
ReplyDeleteFrom the looks of the map, there are about 50kms of coastline. 31 miles.
Not much to control by patrol, with the preponderance of power that Israel has.
A Gitmo of sorts, lineman.
ReplyDeleteA testy problem, to be sure. One that the locals, left to their own devices, cannot begin to remedy amongst themselves.
Paraphrasing what Barack H said, prior to his election,
"If the Israeli don't take the deal, they're nuts".
Now it seems that the Israeli are going to reject "the Deal", proving themselves "nuts".
"Nuts" means being consiered not mentallly competent, no?
While no one argues that the Palistinians are sane, only mitigation as to why they're "nuts".
My condolences, senora.
ReplyDeleteI have a very good imagination. I will try to not let it run away with me.
"If the Israeli don't take the deal, they're nuts".They'd be nuts to take a deal from him and/or his gang.
ReplyDeleteThey'd be better off left to their own solutions without US or Euro meddling.
Seems others here have voiced that same sentiment.
Ditto, Trish.
ReplyDeleteSandy Birdler Arrested at LAX
ReplyDeleteSome smuggler.
ReplyDeleteTail feathers visible below his pants.
I always clip the tail feathers off, when I'm smuggling birds.
You're a rare bird, bob. A rare bird.
ReplyDeleteBut the French people did not abandon Paris.It's an interesting subject. When Napoleon neared Moscow, the Russians left the city, most of them, and burned the place down. Though there is some dispute as to what really caused the fires. Anyway, they left. But they had a heck of a big country to fall back into, filled with people like themselves.
ReplyDeleteThe Germans came to Stalingrad in WW 2, surrounded the place, ended up surrounded in their turn. It seems they could have broken out, but they has a narcissist as leader, back in Germany.
Thanks, Whit, I take that as a compliment.
ReplyDeleteWithin that same month, he met another woman, Josephine Beauharnais. Six years his senior, a fascinating widow with two children – and as much an outsider as himself, she was born and brought up on a plantation in the West Indies.
ReplyDeleteIt was a love at first sight more passionate than anything he wrote: they were lovers within weeks, married the next March, and in December 1804, after the senate was manoeuvred into offering First Consul Bonaparte the title of emperor, he crowned her his empress.
When it all fell apart in wars which shattered and bankrupted Europe, Josephine, long since divorced for failing to produce a male heir, and Napoleon, died in exile on St Helena aged 51 – his last words said to be "France, army, head of the army, Josephine" – his possessions included the manuscript of his novella.Napoleon Bonaparte
Can't think of anything that rhymes or sings for WiO or the gone but not forgotten Mat.
ReplyDeleteRat Roundabout sounds too unserious.
Rue d'Rat has more dignitas.
Anyway I have months to consider the matter.
What happened to Mat?
ReplyDeleteDecided it wasn't worth it arguing with some of us, I quess. Said a pleasant goodbye, hasn't been back.
ReplyDeleteI miss Mat. I'm on his e-mail list, he's still sticking to his guns, just not targeting some of us :)
The fighting is the deadliest outbreak since February, when local officials signed a controversial peace deal with Islamist militants.
ReplyDeleteA provincial official, Information Minister Iftikhar Hussain, said the militants violated the deal that required them to disarm in exchange for the establishment of Islamic law (Sharia) in Malakand Division. The official accused militants of trying to set up a parallel government in the area.
Many in Pakistan believe extremist activities by the Taliban appear to have reduced public support for the militants' cause.Eliminate Terrorists
What happened to Mat?
ReplyDeleteHypersensitive about being called out as a collectivist, among other things. Heat/kitchen syndrome.
He still lurks, believe me.
Captain America, he will save day
ReplyDeleteBarkeep!
ReplyDeleteA shot of the "Capt' America" for bob. Shaken, not stirred.
Thor comes to DVD
ReplyDeleteMy two dollars is riding on Thor.
ReplyDeleteA real thoroughbred.
Superman's Pal
ReplyDeleteCoast to Coast tonite--
ReplyDeleteDoctor of Psychology and Metaphysics, and lifelong student of the human mind, Eldon Taylor will discuss his work in mind control and brainwashing, subliminal suggestion, reverse speech, and how marketers exploit our minds for profit.
First Hour: Author and futurist Stephan Schwartz talks about spiritual epiphaniesMight be worth a listen.
Following his escape, the detention center's superintendent was dismissed and the superintendent's deputy was demoted.
ReplyDeleteMas Selamat first came to prominence in December 2001 when he fled Singapore following an Internal Security Department operation against Jemaah Islamiyah.
He was arrested by the Indonesian police on Bintan island in January 2006 and handed over to Singapore authorities.Held in Malaysia
Watched Star Trek last night. Great movie. Go see it. Worth every penny.
ReplyDeleteShatter ZonesRobert Kaplan, Foreign Affairs
ReplyDelete...A final shatter zone is the Persian core, stretching from the Caspian Sea to Iran’s north to the Persian Gulf to its south. Virtually all of the greater Middle East’s oil and natural gas lies in this region. Just as shipping lanes radiate from the Persian Gulf, pipelines are increasingly radiating from the Caspian region to the Mediterranean, the Black Sea, China, and the Indian Ocean. The only country that straddles both energy-producing areas is Iran, as Geoffrey Kemp and Robert E. Harkavy note in Strategic Geography and the Changing Middle East. The Persian Gulf possesses 55 percent of the world’s crude-oil reserves, and Iran dominates the whole gulf, from the Shatt al-Arab on the Iraqi border to the Strait of Hormuz in the southeast—a coastline of 1,317 nautical miles, thanks to its many bays, inlets, coves, and islands that offer plenty of excellent places for hiding tanker-ramming speedboats.
It is not an accident that Iran was the ancient world’s first superpower. There was a certain geographic logic to it. Iran is the greater Middle East’s universal joint, tightly fused to all of the outer cores. Its border roughly traces and conforms to the natural contours of the landscape—plateaus to the west, mountains and seas to the north and south, and desert expanse in the east toward Afghanistan. For this reason, Iran has a far more venerable record as a nation-state and urbane civilization than most places in the Arab world and all the places in the Fertile Crescent. Unlike the geographically illogical countries of that adjacent region, there is nothing artificial about Iran. Not surprisingly, Iran is now being wooed by both India and China, whose navies will come to dominate the Eurasian sea lanes in the 21st century.
Of all the shatter zones in the greater Middle East, the Iranian core is unique: The instability Iran will cause will not come from its implosion, but from a strong, internally coherent Iranian nation that explodes outward from a natural geographic platform to shatter the region around it.Michael J. Totten on Kaplan's Shatter Zones: "...while I can't vouch for Kaplan accurately describing each of the shatter zones in his piece, I can say he describes those I know well with precision."
via Michael J. Totten
Those who live in a harsh climate, deep within a continent, and cut off from outsiders, tend to be provincial and reactionary.--
ReplyDelete--
Heh.
A decadent statement if I ever did read one.
All the enlightened know virtue resides and surives in the countryside, when it has withered elsewhere. The Romans knew it. Jefferson knew it. Gautama rode away from the palace. Jesus took to the road. Away from all the foul things that slither up out of the cities, up out of the trade routes, where value is judged in coin.
Obumble slithered up out of the city, for instance. Never doing a real days work in his lamentable life. And, in his case, the first thing to go was the respect for human life.
Not that things are perfect in the countryside, mind you. But among other things, there's less temptation, (O Sodom, O Gemorrah) (O Vegas, O Phoenix) always a good thing :) the human race being what it is.
The troubles I've avoided by living here....
Enjoy the Ride, Bob
ReplyDeleteHOMELAND INSECURITY
ReplyDeleteSuspect detained over 'extremist' bumper sticker
'Don't Tread on Me' puts driver in 'watch' category in DHS report
By Bob Unruh
A Louisiana driver has been stopped and detained for having a "Don't Tread on Me" bumper sticker on his vehicle and warned by a police officer about the "subversive" message it sent, according to the driver's relative.
The situation developed in the small town of Ball, La., where a receptionist at the police department told WND she knew nothing about the traffic stop, during which the "suspect" was investigated for "extremist" activities, the relative said.
It followed by only a few weeks the release of a Department of Homeland Security "Right-wing Extremism: Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in Radicalization and Recruitment" report, which prompted outrage from legislators and a campaign calling for the resignation of DHS Secretary Janet Napolitano.
The report cites individuals who sport certain bumper stickers on their vehicles as suspect, and it was delivered to tens of thousands of local law enforcement officers across the nation.
WND is withholding the driver's name and the relative's name at their request.
Thanks, Sam. I did enjoy that, and it was excellent. Sent it on to my friend Dale, who is another sap I know. I know what he'll say too, when he gets back to me, as he will.
ReplyDelete"Bob, that was great..."
"Over 70 and under 6"--straight from Joseph Campbell. Grandfolks and grandkids, they usually have it right.
Pedophile Protectin Act--
ReplyDelete--
"The news is crazy. the whirled insane."
grnite
let's see, what have I accomplished today....:)
Nite, Bob.
ReplyDeleteYou accomplished educating me today.
U.S. Importing Somali 'Pirate-Jihadists'-
ReplyDeleteThe Obama administration is preparing to reinstate a fraud-riddled immigration program that has brought over 36,000 Somalis into the United States under questionable circumstances, including two dozen Minneapolis men that the FBI fears may be planning a terrorist attack.
The FBI has launched an “aggressive” manhunt for the men, who have “gone to ground” and have mysteriously disappeared, terrorism experts tell Newsmax. Authorities fear the men may have been recruited by extremists to carry out suicide attacks inside the United States, or abroad.
Critics of the State Department programs that brought the Somalis to America express grave concerns about the practice of admitting refugees from failed nation-states known to harbor extremists.
Obama Kills Program to Jail Illegals
Oliver North, who has now spent more time in Iraq than he did in 'Nam, says the renewed bombing of Shia civilians is NOT being done by a resurgent al-Queda in Iraq, but by bombers recruited by Iran.
ReplyDeleteThis being done in response to BHO's overtures to make deals w/Iran.
The bombings being used as leverage, or 2 by might say blackmail, threatening to re-ignite a civil war if the Admin is the least bit recalcitrant in playing
"Let's Make a Deal."