tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post7672644698904659144..comments2024-03-28T21:41:52.558-04:00Comments on The Elephant Bar: Israel Attacks Palestinian Relief ShipsDeuce ☂http://www.blogger.com/profile/13472858446242700869noreply@blogger.comBlogger97125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-15694794226227806292010-06-11T14:57:10.940-04:002010-06-11T14:57:10.940-04:00This act of Israel really disappointed every body ...This act of Israel really disappointed every body .When the incident took place i was in <a href="http://www.directtraveller.com" rel="nofollow">hotel kyrenia</a>Rabiccahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18001360589633945099noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-84034313146051005322010-06-02T09:48:33.666-04:002010-06-02T09:48:33.666-04:00What is "Occupation" said...
Let's ...What is "Occupation" said... <br />Let's review...<br /><br />Turkey sponsors an Illegal group of ships trying to supply a terror group with supplies...<br /><br /><br />It's far, far worse than that WiO. The financiers of that flotilla are known terrorists themselves, as my link last evening shows. They are on all the main terrorists’ lists, both foreign and domestic. Turkey supplied the cover of flagging the ships, while terrorists supplied the funding and personnel. Needless to say, our good friends the Saudis figure large in this. <br /><br />So, WiO, why do we care about the Turkish response?<br /><br />Why, wouldn't you think the true patriots here would be incensed that supporters of a'Q (those were the guys responsible for 9/11, unless, of course, you believe that was a Mossad mission, ala David Duke), the Taliban and Iranian "specialists" (these are the guys that build the high-tech explosives that kill American troops in both Iraq and Afghanistan) motivated this spectacle.<br /><br />That they are not outraged speaks volumes as to where their true sympathies lie: They will permit any indignity and outrage so long as Israel's reputation is sullied.<br /><br />I am confused, though, WiO. If as Quirk and company imply, we (Jews) control so much of the media, why the bad press? One would think the Elders would have brought our guys into line with the program.allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01798524644256471907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-80875972471136116742010-05-31T20:06:25.823-04:002010-05-31T20:06:25.823-04:00Ash said...
so, anon, do you think the folks shoul...Ash said...<br />so, anon, do you think the folks should have just let the soldiers take over the ship or do they have a right to defend themselves?<br /><br /><br />The flotilla was an act of war...<br /><br />By all rights Israel could have simply bombed the shit out of it...What is "Occupation"https://www.blogger.com/profile/08237879055691019968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-45279729265217706672010-05-31T18:01:27.241-04:002010-05-31T18:01:27.241-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01798524644256471907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-49740905871874868652010-05-31T18:01:27.240-04:002010-05-31T18:01:27.240-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01798524644256471907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-92232285864077330462010-05-31T17:47:17.111-04:002010-05-31T17:47:17.111-04:00Re: bad, bad, bad Israel, or why it is so nice to ...Re: bad, bad, bad Israel, or why it is so nice to have a civilized country to lump on, rather than face North Korea...gutless wonders...allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01798524644256471907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-45729489816987632212010-05-31T17:09:36.990-04:002010-05-31T17:09:36.990-04:00so, anon, do you think the folks should have just ...so, anon, do you think the folks should have just let the soldiers take over the ship or do they have a right to defend themselves?Ashhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16688752302081088907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-50486137166578127612010-05-31T16:55:04.801-04:002010-05-31T16:55:04.801-04:00these people on board the relief ship were not pea...<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYjkLUcbJWo&feature=player_embedded" rel="nofollow">these people on board the relief ship were not peace activists</a>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-36925033786729736522010-05-31T15:39:00.814-04:002010-05-31T15:39:00.814-04:00Yeah, I agree that there are other reasons for Bib...Yeah, I agree that there are other reasons for Bib to not keep his meeting with Obama. It appears as if the IDF dropped onto the boat expecting them to quietly acquiesce to their orders but the folks on the boat resisted and the shooting began. It is entirely possible that Bibi knew that they were going to board the boats in international waters. It is also entirely possible the Obama said no to the meeting.<br /><br />In any case the action doesn't seem to helping Israels position very well now that the worlds attention has been drawn to the severity of the Israeli blockade of Gaza.Ashhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16688752302081088907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-18614074855676298252010-05-31T14:00:35.655-04:002010-05-31T14:00:35.655-04:00You are dreaming Rat...
turkey's credibility ...You are dreaming Rat...<br /><br />turkey's credibility as a NATO ally is about ZERO.<br /><br />and her embrace of syria and iran recently shows what side the toast is buttered on.<br /><br />If I was turkey? I'd be more concerned about the civil war about to hit it...<br /><br />PKK shall rise...<br /><br />Turkey shall fall...<br /><br />and? Cyprus wil be a war zone againWhat is "Occupation"https://www.blogger.com/profile/08237879055691019968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-68366286276444777842010-05-31T13:58:09.447-04:002010-05-31T13:58:09.447-04:00Ash said...
If Bibi has to return to Israel to dea...Ash said...<br />If Bibi has to return to Israel to deal with the crisis it suggests to me that he is not in control of his government and that the raid was undertaken without his knowledge. If he was fully aware of the raid then I would expect him to continue on with his scheduled meetings and make his case for undertaking the action.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Nonsense...<br /><br />Obama threw Israel under the bus last week and not a peep out of the MSM.<br /><br />Bibi understands that Obama wanted to USE bibi as a prop to sure up the American Jewish vote (donors).<br /><br />Obama has lost 1/2 of his Jewish support in 6 monthsWhat is "Occupation"https://www.blogger.com/profile/08237879055691019968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-33610001388001081932010-05-31T11:52:21.373-04:002010-05-31T11:52:21.373-04:00"Equivalent, Q, the word is equivalent.
The ...<i>"Equivalent, Q, the word is equivalent.<br /><br />The whole point of the Equivalency Campaign.<br /><br />It's working!"</i><br /><br /><br /><br />No rat.<br /><br />Bushwa. The word is bushwa.<br /><br />Another attempted non sequitur.<br /><br />Don't try to bullshit a bullshitter.<br /><br /><br />.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-23355278244818753182010-05-31T11:24:58.883-04:002010-05-31T11:24:58.883-04:00Or did he fly to the United States, when Bibi did?...Or did he fly to the United States, when Bibi did?<br /><br />Did they fly together?<br /><br />Did he fly back to DC, at all?desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-22760102998471965882010-05-31T11:23:02.740-04:002010-05-31T11:23:02.740-04:00They did not foresee the political firestorm, ash....They did not foresee the political firestorm, ash.<br /><br />Look at 'misdirection's posts. The Israeli did not kill enough people of the flotilla to matter.<br /><br />If that opinion has any prominence in Israel, and no Israeli posts to tell us it does not, then their actions were deemed acceptable.<br /><br />The international reaction, dismissed or not realized before hand.<br /><br />Obama's "right hand man", his Chief of Staff, is still there in Israel, is he not?<br /><br />What message does that send?desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-8230265025504938772010-05-31T11:13:47.134-04:002010-05-31T11:13:47.134-04:00If Bibi has to return to Israel to deal with the c...If Bibi has to return to Israel to deal with the crisis it suggests to me that he is not in control of his government and that the raid was undertaken without his knowledge. If he was fully aware of the raid then I would expect him to continue on with his scheduled meetings and make his case for undertaking the action.Ashhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16688752302081088907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-91020034937910121122010-05-31T11:04:21.614-04:002010-05-31T11:04:21.614-04:00The Pirates of the Mediterranean strike again!The <b>Pirates of the Mediterranean</b> strike again!desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-19646610905307189482010-05-31T10:58:36.485-04:002010-05-31T10:58:36.485-04:00The Israeli have attacked a NATO member, on the hi...The Israeli have attacked a NATO member, on the high seas.<br /><br />There was no crisis of identification. The Israeli knew full well whose flag flew on those ships.<br /><br />It was not Egyptian.<br />Never was.desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-88296962167333121042010-05-31T10:56:32.882-04:002010-05-31T10:56:32.882-04:00Unintended consequences, Deuce, unintended consequ...Unintended consequences, Deuce, unintended consequences.<br /><br />Often arises from armed aggression.desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-27045536976287007202010-05-31T10:53:42.622-04:002010-05-31T10:53:42.622-04:00They obviously meant to provoke, but the "the...They obviously meant to provoke, but the "they" was not the Turkish government. <br /><br />Regardless, "they" were unarmed vessels in international waters. If they entered Israeli waters the Israelis had the right to stop them.<br /><br />That is not what is being reported. <br /><br />Israel is forcing the hand of governments normally friendly to Israel to do and say things that are not good for Israel.<br /><br />Israel is being very foolish.Deuce ☂https://www.blogger.com/profile/13472858446242700869noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-31452032551221247812010-05-31T10:50:32.430-04:002010-05-31T10:50:32.430-04:00But if Turkey does not invoke Article 5, that give...But if Turkey does not invoke Article 5, that gives lie to the Israeli story line, that the Turkish Government are really radical Islamoids.desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-81896088701273417952010-05-31T10:47:56.762-04:002010-05-31T10:47:56.762-04:00We must move against piracy, on the high seas.
Th...We must move against piracy, on the high seas.<br /><br />That is why we maintain 11 carrier battle groups. Just for situations like this, where pirates attack NATO flagged shipping, on the high seas.<br /><br />The least US reaction should be an arms embargo, on the government sponsoring the pirates.desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-46989272627381527462010-05-31T10:44:38.630-04:002010-05-31T10:44:38.630-04:00We do not want the Turks to invoke Article 5. If y...We do not want the Turks to invoke Article 5. If you think that through, you will not want it either. My bewilderment is why on earth would Israel do something so reckless?<br /><br /><i>"The United States deeply regrets the loss of life and injuries sustained, and is currently working to understand the circumstances surrounding this tragedy," said White House spokesman William Burton.<br /><br />President Barack Obama was in Chicago for the Memorial Day holiday. He had been scheduled to meet with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas at the White House on Tuesday but that meeting was now in doubt as Netanyahu considered returning home to handle the crisis.<br /> <br />Britain's Foreign Secretary William Hague also deplored the loss of life in the incident.<br /><br />He said: "I deplore the loss of life during the interception of the Gaza flotilla. Our embassy is in urgent contact with the Israeli government.<br /><br />"We are asking for more information and urgent access to any UK nationals involved.<br />"We have consistently advised against attempting to access Gaza in this way because of the risks involved. But at the same time, there is a clear need for Israel to act with restraint and in line with international obligations.<br />"It would be important to establish the facts about this incident and especially whether enough was done to prevent death and injuries.<br /><br />"This news underlines the need to lift the restrictions on access to Gaza in line with UNSCR (UN Security Council Resolution) 1860."<br />UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon said he was "shocked" by the Israeli raid.</i>Deuce ☂https://www.blogger.com/profile/13472858446242700869noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-79957022253532905932010-05-31T10:41:03.463-04:002010-05-31T10:41:03.463-04:00That is what mutual defense is all about, coming t...That is what mutual defense is all about, coming to the aid of Treaty allies, when they are attacked without provocation.desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-76362303814023412582010-05-31T10:39:48.910-04:002010-05-31T10:39:48.910-04:00Personally, I hope the Turks do invoke Article 5, ...Personally, I hope the Turks do invoke Article 5, against the <b>Pirates of the Mediterranean</b><br /><br />A complete arms embargo on the Pirates, to start.<br /><br />Less than enough, but enough to start.desert rathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02369546288659566961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21297199.post-89029482076613444292010-05-31T10:36:22.573-04:002010-05-31T10:36:22.573-04:00The Europeans are going ape over this and what doe...The Europeans are going ape over this and what does the US do if Turkey envokes Article 5 of the NATO agreement?<br /><br /><i>Article 5<br /><br />The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.<br />Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .</i><br /><br />Obviously the diplomatic wheels must be turning to stop that from happening, but they were unarmed Turkish flagged ships in international waters. <br /><br />The ships' mission was obviously to provoke Israel, to goad them into doing something foolish. From that standpoint it was a mission accomplished moment.<br /><br />Israel has walked into a diplomatic trap, if radical factions in the Turkish government want to envoke article 5, or use it as a means to embarrass US support for Isreal.<br /><br />The preamble to the NATO Charter reads:<br /><br /><i>The Parties to this Treaty reaffirm their faith in the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations and their desire to live in peace with all peoples and all governments.<br />They are determined to safeguard the freedom, common heritage and civilisation of their peoples, founded on the principles of democracy, individual liberty and the rule of law. They seek to promote stability and well-being in the North Atlantic area.<br />They are resolved to unite their efforts for collective defence and for the preservation of peace and security. They therefore agree to this North Atlantic Treaty </i><br /><br />This is not the Memorial Day weekend the Obama Administration was looking forward to.Deuce ☂https://www.blogger.com/profile/13472858446242700869noreply@blogger.com